I'm guessing his speech will go something like this.....

"I'm working hard for you. I've been able to take control of 2 privately held car companies and hand over a majority / controlling interest to you, my beloved unions.

I'm not done yet. If I can get the stupid Americans to stop paying so much attention, we had 10 BILLION stuffed in the health-care overhaul bill for additional union helathcare / retiree plans.

I'm not done yet, I have not forgot about givng you union thugs the final hammer, card check (Employee Free Choice Act), so the heavies can strong-arm fellow workers into joining unions"

Yea, this president is a piece of work..... really looking out for everyone.

You think people are ticked now about gov't controlled health-care, wait until they try to stuff Cap & Trade (Crap & Tax) the largest tax increase know to man, Card Check, and Amnesty for Illegal down our throats.

Between the unions and this president, it is hard to figure who want to kill businesses worse.... it is a tossup.

TkWIs,,,,,Smart if Obama is so Smart why will he not release his transcripts? At least he has a captive Audience,when the Union says to its members to be there they will show up,Just like the sheeple they are.

These koolaide drinkers will still blame Bush if the cost of toilet paper goes up a hundred years from now.

.... because we'll still need the extra toilet paper to wash off the Bush $h1t 100 years from now.

Time for the unions' annual French kiss.

Of course the Unions will support this bill! They were given billions in GM and Chrysler stock in return for the millions they donated to Obama in campaign funds. They are offered billions more in Taxpayer funds to subsidize their healthcare in the House Bill. How do you justify Taxpayers paying for Union workers healthcare? It is simply outrageous!! American, Democrats, Republican, Independents have to stand together in opposition against this tactic! Taxpayers should not be responsible to paying for Wall Street the Car Companies and for the Unions. This has to stop! This is not one party against another party issue it is about the raping of the American Tax Payer.

After we put it there. Hey look what we found. The yellow cake was debunked along time ago Doctor Larry.

dBurger.. not bail outs... Pay offs.

The right-wing crazies refer to unions as communism. Little do they know it is just the market correcting itself in a capitalist system. We have no more child labor, sweat shops, or unsafe work environments because of unions in earlier days.

Now only about 25% of workers belong to a union, and benefits such as pension plans, COLAs, and health care are disappearing. We do not want to return to the days of Mafia involvement (an unfortunate hijacking), but we do need checks and balances. Federal labor laws are very limited, and if it weren't for the minimum wage (not a living wage, but just so employers don't go below that), who knows what our standard of living would be like today.

Let's remember those who risked their jobs and even their lives to help the U.S. rise above third-world exploitation. And shame on ignorant right-wing Haters who spit upon labor, our government, civil rights, and all the values that makes our country a better place to be.

Chuck, DAL, Jim V,

The Iraq scientist working at Tuwaitha where the 'Yellow Cake' was stored also said they would have had a WORKING nuclear device by 2005. I wounder where they were getting that fissionable material from???????? I guess those rusting drums and the underground pools of radioactive water........

You also neglect to mention that UN inspections had not been conducted for over 3 years. And nothing was safeguarded or controlled, because Sadam was the one holding ALL the keys and guards....

Keep spinning the BS, there were four other nuclear sites that were NEVER inspected. Because the UN did not know they existed or Sadam would not let the inspectors go there. You can fool some of the people, but some of us were on the ground and saw these facilities......... Just ask the US Marines that were the first ones on these sites after IRAQ II started.........

see - www.msnbc.com/ID/25546334/ or YAHOO - TUWAITHA nuclear device or yellow cake

Semper Fi

It was the same words over an over. I think I heard the same written speech during the campaign.

obama's 'worker' party of unions and paid community activists...show how being one of the zombie followers can pay big with money from hard working taxpayers and government give aways like: car companies and special positions within government for like minded socialist. Go away obama and take your BIG government with you!

Why is Obama talking about healthcare to union members.? Union members, like the Congress are the only ones who are exempt from it. In fact those of us who aren't will be, according to the bill, subsidizing the union members cadillac private plans - so our fees will pay for their private coverage. Of course they are cheering for it.

Unbelievable.

Obama is the biggest "JACK OFF" this country has ever seen! Hope all of his supporters are happy now!

", to put aside the partisanship,

Everytime I hear that phrase, if spoken by Republican or Democrat, I hear, "Shut up and do what I want". It is usually said in defense of an underhanded no good bill. This is not an exeption.

The unions bear a large part of the blame for the horrific economy--Look at the rust bucket states and the rust bucket parts of the economy like Michigan and the Automakers! The problem was largely the union contracts which forced management to pay workers more than their value added to the automobiles they were manufacturing.

In the Southern states that are not union shop states, car manufacturers from abroad are opening new large factories and paying fair--not inflated--wages and folks are clamoring for these good paying family supporting jobs.

Mitt Romney was so right. He advocated letting the car companies fail (management made mistakes too) and go into reorganization, renegotiate all contracts with unions (or change the laws in those states to do away with unions--my idea not Mitt's) downward and save both the companies and the jobs. How did the unions end up with some ownership in these companies overlooking the capital put into them by shareholders.

Unions were important back when labor was abused by management. Now they are being abused by unions that keep wages so artificially high that the poor guys are now unemployed in droves.

Go Obama Socialist Workers Party--Go "back to the USSR."

P.S. The UAW would love to get this passed. The took over the healthcare for GM, Chrysler, and Ford. They would love to get out from under that obligation.

It is so obvious ,the way the left is pushing this health care thing, that it is NOT about health care, or caring about the people. The left could give a damn about us. The health care thing is all about power, money and control. That is why the left is so anal about getting it passed. They dont seem to be getting the message, WE DONT WANT ANY!!!!

Hmmmmmmm !!!!!!!!!!!

Well, I read about the first twenty or so comments. As far as Universal Health Care goes, it is a bad idea to have the government involved. Government control has not gotten anything right--Medicare is on the road to bankruptcy ! and part of their bills plan is to take some of the Medicare money and use it for other people, right that makes a lot of sense.

What we need is Accountability, Transparency and a Huge dose of Ethics to be used by the Medical, Pharma, Insurance and Lawyer Organizations. There is way to much C--P going on by all of these groups.

The doctors and the Pharma groups are way too cozy with each other.

The doctors need to establish and post their rates for everything they do. Including Hospitals and ER rooms, etc.

Insurance companies need to stop changing the rules every chance they get.

Each State needs to step up and start making all these organizations much more accountable.

Unfortunately, trying to rein-in the lawyers is asking alot. Since most of their profession controls most of the Legislatures/Congress by having a disproportionate number of their members in these controlling bodies of government. I keep hearing Term limits being professed. Hey, it isn't going to happen ! We need to vote all these people out. and if a Lawyer is running for office, then automatically do not vote for Him/Her. (Some of you wanted a solution--that's basically it !!)

And as I have said so many times before--Remember the Third Great Lie. "Hi, I'm from the government and I'm here to help you."

Here are some interesting things to consider....

During the early 1970s, Congress decided it liked the HMO model of healthcare, as opposed to people buying catastrophic insurance, then paying cash for normal medical visits.

They inacted the HMO Act of 1973, forcing employers to offer HMOs to their employees. They tinkered with the tax code to exclude health insurance from being taxed, if bought through an employer. This introduced the model we have today, and in effect brought about the middle men - insurance companies, between us and our healthcare. This caused massive paperwork and red tape, removed consumers from paying attention to price and costs (as they were being billed to a third party - not to them directly, and presto, we have an inefficient, bloated, and increasingly expensive system.

Now the Government thinks that more intervention from them, can fix this system caused by their tinkering before? I don't see how changing out the middle men from insurance companies to the government can do anything but become a massively expensive disaster which provides a red tape nightmare and horrific service.

Why would we entrust the source of the problem (the Government) to be the source of the solution - and expect a different outcome?

How will the Right-wing spin this as some sort of Devilish, anti-American gesture?

I am so glad that my 5 year olds, on their own volition, castigated Republicanism as "emotionally driven thinking from the reptilian part of the brain."

The unions definition of paid leave is; Sitting at home unproductive on unemployment.

get Real, they worked hard at destroying Unions years ago for Cheap Labor and the aspects of it..now they eulogize this diminished event.. now, most people are working for minimum wage..now health care, again the working people will pay for it..of the employment that's what is left in this nation..don't go think the status-quo is going to pay for it..this Country has rewarded the wealthy from day one..that's not going to change..as for the 40/50 million of the uninsured that will be FORCED to pay..I foresee many boarding houses and tent cities.......

What about 60% + against the current health care plan does he not understand? Hey Obama...hey the Amercan people are saying HELL NO to our Congressmen and Senators when they came home, except for Rep. John Tanner (TN) and a few others who refuse to meet with us during the break. We don't want your Health care plan! The word is out, they change their attitude, and VOTES, or in 2010, they'll be unemployed.

If this HealthCare is a big change like the rest of his changes I am sure we can do without it?

Per the article: "The insurance industry strongly opposes the public option and has spent millions of dollars lobbying against it, while conservative commentators have fanned fears of a government takeover of healthcare akin to socialism."

Oh well. Do nothing. When Medicare goes bust in about 2 years, fund it for the old folks already getting it with another tax source until the last one passes away, and disband it completely - no new recipients. Require the non-retired to fund their own private insurance with whatever HMO will take them, with a law that the HMO cannot dump them for being old and sickly. After all, since a gov't option is so odious, the private market will help us all end the ponzi scheme known as Medicare - forever. (Yeah, right.)

Next up, ending that other ponzi scheme, Social Security.

Funny, when Obama does something that doesn't work, it's the market correcting itself, or it's him inheriting W's problems. They always seem to have an excuse. The lies and passing the blame is the only thing transparent Obama and his kool-aid drinking zombies have brought to Washington.

Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, well I won't be fooled twice, 2010/2012, I get to vote again. And it won't be for these incompentents in DC now, or for any of the hateful lefties, as the posts above demonstrate.

PS: I didn't like Bush, am not a Republican, nor am I religious zealot, so please when you attack me, try to use some new lies, oh, I mean material :)

The Iraq scientist working at Tuwaitha where the 'Yellow Cake' was stored also said they would have had a WORKING nuclear device by 2005.

Exactly how is that possible since WE have had control of it since BEFORE the iraq War. at ALL three facilities. name of siad scientist please, oh and some back up.

There are also three key facilities on the Al-Tuwaitha reservation that are rarely mentioned in media accounts of the transfer. First, there is the French reactor at Site B, better known as Osirak, which was destroyed by the Israelis in 1981 in Operation Opera. The second facility is the Russian built reactor at Site A, destroyed by the US in Gulf War I in 1991. The third facility is a fuel fabrication plant at Site D, also destroyed in 1991. All three facilities have never been rebuilt. All spent fuel or fresh fuel was sent back to the country of origin after Gulf War I.

you people never quit lying .

thank the unions for $40/hr assemblers who are driving our manufacturing out of the country and driving domestic product prices so high they cannot compete with imports.

Um... manufacturing has been up .and it is the ridiculous compensation pkges paid to execs that is the biggest problem.

I know that bites your nads but it's true. Too bad for you!

Anyone who promotes a government run healthcare program should read this objective analysis of the pitfalls of the NHS, written in 2000 by an expert who was invited by the Neufield Trust (an NHS organization) in 1998 to assess the impact of "competitive market" reforms he had suggested in the 80's on the NHS.

content.healthaffairs.org/cgi/reprint/19/3/102.pdf

The following are excerpts from this paper.

"The traditional NHS structure of centralized planning and top-down management control lacks a coherent strategy for motivating innovation and improvement."

"It is doubtful whether a culture of innovation, efficiency, and good customer service is possible in a public-sector monopoly whose services are in excess demand and whose units do not get more resources for caring for more patients. It is also doubtful whether then NHS can modernize without consumer choice, competition, and more resources."

"People found that the best way to strengthen their case for more resources was by doing a poor job with what they had. If they were efficient, they would be forced to subsidize the inefficient. They also knew that if they improved the quality of their services, they would attract more patients but not the additional resources to care for them...The best course for one's career was to please the people in the hierarchy who control one's budget and career, rather than innovating to make things better for patients."

"Governments systematically favor provider interests over consumer interests; competitive markets generally do the reverse."

Just stop and look at the above... Everyone it at each others throats.

Amazing how this leader can pull everyone together isn't it?

Remember nearly half didn't vote for Obama and many are running from him now after they have quickly learned he is a hollow suit - he can make a good speech and thats about all.

God help us, and more importantly God help our kids and grand kids who will have to clean up after him... Yes he will have a legacy all right... Seems to me he need to get in touch with middle America cause he's certainly lost it quickly.

What is it about "no public option" do these liberals not understand? This country was founded on freedom of speech, no taxation without representation (no there's a concept) and the basics of no tyranny. I realize that Obama thinks he has a mandate - but he just doesn't get it. His so-called mandate was about people being anti-Bush, not pro-Obama socialism. He is truly a tyrant - God help us all.

Obama should have used the occasion to announce that he and his family, all Executive Department staff and all Union Members had committed to switching their coverage to the government option.  That might help to give the rest of us some confidence in his screwball ideas.  Fat Chance. 

The writer of this article needs to get his facts strait. "and inherited wars in Iraq and Afghanistan" Let's set the record correct now! Afgahanistan is Obama's war. Anyone that thinks different, check the facts. Don't just type and babble. The author did get one fact correct. Obama's rating has plummeted in the past month below 50%, Just so you Dems know, that's a record, next to Jimmy Carter, your other savior.

Go for it, Pres! Show them the man you are. There isn't a politician out there who can come close.

wall.al, you're about eight years behind. You're thinking of Bush, not Obama. It was Bush who started all of the things you are talking about.

skipastar

He has always been busy, he has done more work and tried harder than an president we have had for a long time. His motives are pure, the current health care system is not only unfair, wasteful it is making the insurance co's RICH.

I didn't know insurance companies, oil companies, and small businesses were suppose to work to be POOR. Maybe you Liberals know something I don't.

National health care would actually be a good thing and is in many countries. But with this countries track record, it would be safer for all of us if they didn't do it here. But something does need to be done! How many solid gold toilet seats do the insurance CEOs really need?

sadiemae14 mentioned taxation without representation, we have representation. Our representatives look at the budget, then look at their pay raises, then decide that the only way they can get their raises is to raise our taxes to pay for it. Doesn't that sound like a fair system? And don't forget, they are helping the obscenely rich CEO's send all our jobs to China, then they look at falling tax revenues and start eyeing our decreasing paychecks. Something has to give and I think it should stop being those of us who work (or in my case worked, thanks for sending my job to China) for a living.

Those email ads I keep getting to "come work in Australia" are starting to look more and more appealing.

Robert Perkins. I would define 46% of the popular vote as "nearly half."

President Obama 365 electoral votes, 53% 66,882,230 votes

McSame 173 electroal votes,46% 58,343,671

Although I'm neither a Demopublican or a Republicrat, I find it quite interesting that only NOW does the concept of the Electoral Vote, as opposed to the Popular Vote (anyone remember Al Gore squealing like a stuck pig?) matter when it comes to the "Golded Child of Marxism".

So now, all of a sudden the Electoral College DOES Matter?? The point is, that when the MAJORITY of Americans say "We Don't Want It" - why is it so hard for the Obama Regime to get that?? Why does the Majority matter only when it goes THEIR Way??

Um... manufacturing has been up .and it is the ridiculous compensation pkges paid to execs that is the biggest problem.

Clearly, manufacturing is up... In China... in India... in the Phillipines... in Taiwan.... in Mexico...

Robert Perkins

Get Real

President Obama 365 electoral votes, 53% 66,882,230 votes

McSame 173 electroal votes,46% 58,343,671

Those numbers are so old now. Today, these are the only numbers that count:

- The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Monday shows that 28% of the nation's voters Strongly Approve of the way that Barack Obama is performing his role as President. Forty-one percent (41%) Strongly Disapprove giving Obama a Presidential Approval Index rating of -13.

- Overall, 48% of voters say they at least somewhat approve of the President's performance. Fifty-one percent (51%) disapprove.

- 53 Percent of Americans Oppose Democratic Government-Run Health Plan

Maybe YOU need to Get Real.

Salgal, it sounds like jealousy has taken over your mind.

exactly we'll be "Fired up" and "Ready to Go." after you watch this (A MUST SEE).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCbFEgFajGU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fx--jNQYNgA&feature=related

Keep drinking the cool aid. and now they're trying to mis-inform our kidz.

I think for any healthcare reform, it should start with the individual. Prevention and education is hands down the cheapest option available. Americans need to start actually taking care of themselves. Be more active and exercise. Eat more healthier and in smaller potions. Start adding PE back in schools. Educate on basic fundamentals of health, health systems and medications.

Too many are uncompliant on medications and sharing. And many more are straining on Emergency rooms for non-lifethreatening injuries or illnesses. (colds, minor cuts, stomach aches for 3 weeks, etc). I see Americans not taking care of themselves and that too me is very selffish. They want everyone else to take care of them. Need to fix how our food supply is handled and run. Majority of our food supply is made out of corn. Yes its cheap but too much is not healthy. Majority of the high costs come from getting treated for illnesses that stem from years and years of poor lifestyle.

I saw this very obese lady who came in to the emergency complaining of back pain a month ago. Complained that it took hours to be seen. She should've went to a clinic if she want to be seen quicker. Cheapest and the most effective treatment for her back would have been exercise, be more active and eat more healthier than a lifetime of expensive meds.

I know they have punishments for people that abuse the 911 system. Why not use it on the emergency room?

Being a union worker myself, I'm not sure which is more corrupt our gov't or unions, it's amazing what you see happening in this country. If this were 60 years ago I'd say lets go all union, but now I can't even stand working for the union, they are sucking more and more money just like our gov't while spewing off that they are helping us, and all I'm seeing is decreased benefits while our union boss make 6 figures and we're not talking a low 6 figures. I have 3 boss's now, the union, the gov't and my job. FREEDOM, FREEDOM, FREEDOM, FREEDOM. I haven't been free since I started working and I have no debt to my name, can you imagine ppl that live paycheck to paycheck. I have no choice's in any decision's in my life anymore anyway who gives a @!$%# what anyone does anymore.

Obama talking to a bunch of union people. Talk about preachin' to the choir.

NATIONWIDE protest against ALL Socialism - At your local SOCIALIST LIBRARY 09/24/09

We're NOW ASSEMBLING at LIBRARIES so ACORN doesn't HOSE US DOWN

http://www.angrytownhall.com/

pearsoncrz, to put it mildly, the government and the providers are in bed together. Uncle sam considers the providers to be the constituents. The common people are left out of the loop. The providers consider the government to be the customer. This equates to a horrifying situation when it's in the context of health care. Medical providers bow down to the wishes of the government (cut costs, cut costs, cut costs!). Medical equipment suppliers are chained by the orders of government technocrats. They can't provide the public with needed wheel chairs, crutches, canes, etc. because of claim denials by our government- the government we all support and pay for. We, the people, are the losers in this game.

Much paranoia, hyperbole, and fear-mongering in these posts and, unfortunately, very little reason. It's like watching people puke with their brains and rub it onto the screen with their fingers.

Many of you seem to forget the concept of 'We the People'. You're constantly looking for an 'Us versus Them' scenario, and even if one isn't convenient, you'll go out of your way to create it.

You're bashing unions? Sure, some unions get a little carried away with their power and control, but you do realize that without the counterweight of unions, the corporations of this country would do whatever they pleased (moreso than they already do) to the workers. If you're against unions you are for corporations, with a very fine line in-between.

Capitalism is not perfect, far from it. Wake up. Capitalism is maniulated all the time by the people who - you guessed it - have the capital. Don't argue what you don't understand. The Capitalism of this country is already regulated by things like the SEC, wage laws, OSHA, etc. Should we get rid of those laws and let the companies that pay us dictate what the workers should earn? I guarantee almost every one of you out there appreciate that form of Socialism, and probably don't even view it as Socialism, right? Hypocrites.

Also, there are rules in place to prevent Capitalistic corporations from getting too big, controlling too much (though those laws appear to be a littel lacking), especially when it comes to monopolization. Isn't monopolization just winning the game of Capitalism? So surely if Capitalism is perfect in it's pure state, you must be in favor of corporate monopolies as well, yes? Of course that benefits the masses as well as the owners (stock holders) of these companies, right?

Errr, no...

Man. Looking at these posts is unreal. I thought Obama was going to "unite us in the name of bi-partisanship." It looks to me like there is more division and vitriol than ever before in this country. In fact I don't EVER remember seeing this much polarization between, not just parties, but ordinary citizens.

I think Obama has used class warfare and envy and forced his domestic policies on us to the point that it has driven a huge wedge between the citizens of this country.

I wonder if there will be anything left by the time he's gone in 2012?

TruePatriot-445959 Restored

I was fired up reading these historical impudents ramble on about unions, and read your post and decided points well made, if one can't understand what you just said then I would assume their educational capacity has not yet met a standard to comprehend your meaning.

I note your post was collapsed , then restored, small minds fear intelligent response's. Your post had nothing offensive except knowledge and truth.

ANSWERS American Citizens Should Demand From Our Naive Socialist Community-Organizer President, Barack Hussein Obama: "How many jobs have unions created in America? How many economic booms has unions created in America? Do unions stimulate or dampen businesses in America? Will unionizing America destroy the fabric of our business and economy?"

Barack Hussein Obama has read SO much from the socialist and communist playbook that it's hard for him to tell what's happened and what's going on!

To go so far as to say the UNIONS MADE THE MIDDLE CLASS??????

LMFAO!!!!

The American DREAM made the middle class. American FREE TRADE and BUSINESS made the middle class. American PROSPERITY made the middle class. At least? Since the DEPRESSION.

Barry equating Unions to CREATING the MIDDLE CLASS? Is tantamount to saying UNIONS ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE AMERICAN DREAM! OR WORSE - UNIONS *ARE* THE AMERICAN DREAM!

LMFAO!!! Wrong AGAIN, Mr, President!

Barack Hussein Obama - Naivete Extraordinaire.

Wow.

Wake Up America!

Don't believe the Lies and Rhetoric.

THINK.

smart— voter wrote...."Between the unions and this president, it is hard to figure who want to kill businesses worse.... it is a tossup!"

Yes, I agree. Just a few manufacturing companies are left in the U. S. , and I would like to be around when either obama or the UAW tries to tell China what to do. I can't recall any hardware item that I have that was not made in China - damn good workmanship! Hey, I just got a brilliant idea! China should offer a U. S. Health Care Insurance Plan! Hot doggie!

Does anyone know how many pension funds have been spent by corporations since the 1980's and then those corporations have declared bankruptcy and dumped the pensions funds on the feds ? and you talk about Unions how about corporate welfare? where are the law for protection of pension funds?

LMFAO!!! Did I just hear the Naivete Extraordinaire say that he'd create MASSIVE MANUFACTURING JOBS FOR AMERICA?

Hey Barry? America isn't an industrial age country, OK? We're in something called the information age! Good luck bringing back our steel industry. LMFAO!!! Naive.

Did I just hear the Naivete Extraordinaire say that the economic stimulus HAS WORKED? America, please ask him HOW!

The simple fact of the matter is our Jr Senator turned President? Is still in CAMPAIGN MODE and just saying things ... things that fly in the face of simple realities and fact ...

Wake Up, America.

Does anyone know how many pension funds have been spent by corporations since the 1980's and then those corporations have declared bankruptcy and dumped the pensions funds on the feds ? and you talk about Unions how about corporate welfare? where are the law for protection of pension funds?

What choo talkin bout palco?

LMFAO!!!

Pray tell. Say it again please?

Palco and True

The website listed in 1.68 is a real website. It is intended as humor and sarcasm - it is not mine.

But - everyone needs to look in that mirror, occasionally and see the face that is looking back.

Keep up the good work, I have enjoyed your posts.

Obama must be paying some folks to post today. I haven't seen anyone defending him all week except a few Bush bashers that can't get over the fact that Obama is worse by far. Obama's numbers on polls are the worst of any President in recent history--even liberal Zogby that is almost always points off to favor D's finds Obama only has a 43% approval rating and that is "generally" approve. Rasmussen has him at -11 to -14 depending on the day this week. He is tanking and so is support for his "Healthscare."

Of Course the Unions want it as it has billions of pork tucked into the currently drafted legislation for union members (we will all just need to form our own unions I guess to get at the bennies). It also has bennies for "community organizers" and so I guess we will all have to form "wallnut" or "hazel nut" to keep up with the other nuts getting all the perks--ACORN.

Write your legislators once again and don't go to Washington on the 12th or participate locally.

DrWhoo

As usual you are a bit late out of the gate, wall street, to big to fail banks, and are financial sector have destroyed the fabric of our business community by making nothing except paper fraud and credit default,derivatives, and commodity schemes, do you have any clue as to what has just happened ? blaming unions is like looking in the graveyard for a victim to pin a case on, In all you posts you keep referring to some free market, supply demand economics of which there is not, Its a manipulated market place that is free to the insiders and supply has nothing to do with demand in costs or pricing, look no further than the gas pump.

DrWhoo

As usual you are a bit late out of the gate, wall street, to big to fail banks, and are financial sector have destroyed the fabric of our business community by making nothing except paper fraud and credit default,derivatives, and commodity schemes, do you have any clue as to what has just happened ? blaming unions is like looking in the graveyard for a victim to pin a case on, In all you posts you keep referring to some free market, supply demand economics of which there is not, Its a manipulated market place that is free to the insiders and supply has nothing to do with demand in costs or pricing, look no further than the gas pump.

Palco?

It makes sense that a fool layman like yourself be orders of magnitude MORE incompetent than your Naive Leader ...

Wall Street? Is NOT American business!!! LMFAO!!!!

Wall Street? Is a small and MINOR aspect of it in actually. They are part of the financial structure of it but they ARE NOT AMERICAN BUSINESS.

Example. Wall Street didn't create Apple Computer or the mom and pop grocery store down the street.

Get it?

Probably NOT!!!

BTW did you find the LINK for that Health Care CEO who got a $325m bonus yet? LMFAO!! Pathetic.

See, you sheepish libs just follow the ill-thought-out Pelosian talking points. Bashing on Wall Street and Insurance companies is a red herring to sneak your socialist agenda under America's Nose.

Wake Up, America!

Y'all heard Barack Hussein Obama talk in front of a Union Crowd in Ohio today, right? Well it all fits part of a pattern ...

Unions. Socialists. Communists. Screaming Radicals ...

Barack Hussein Obama's Best Friends, Appointees, Mentors, Associates and Beneficiaries ...

Barack Hussein Obama's Mentor, Father Figure and Inspiration - Jeremiah Wright:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc2FCJ7zWEQ

Van Jones: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOgmwyfKuL8

Bill Ayers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvROBLortBQ

ACORN: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NmaZIdz6Vo

Louis Farrakhan (calling Obama the "Messiah" LMFAO!!!):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9cRpS5mSq0

Wow ...

Crazy World We Live In ...

America... Mr. Obama is dead set on making this a Marxist nation.  Everything he touches, every move he makes, every bill he pushes, is another step towards Marxism.   He is relentless.  He is tireless.  And he is wrong.  America has been careless with it's freedom.  It has placed it in the hands of those who would take it away forever.  There is still time.  We must take our country back.  Tell your Congressional representatives to vote "NO" on government health care.  Tell them to vote "NO" on "Cap and Trade".  Then any of them that vote for either bill... vote them out of office ASAP.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJ5T6EoI5d0

Socializing Health Care. Cap and Trade. Unions. Higher Taxes. Big Government. Bad Government. Idiotically Wasteful "stimulus" programs.

How these things will kill American Business ...

America? Why aren't you getting this information on CNN, ABC, CBS and LMFAO!!! NBC?

Makes sense the BBC has no clue. That's why Britain and Europe is stagnant. Besides being the most BORING news org ... the BBC is government subsidized BTW ... LMFAO!!!

Think about it.

The Time is Now for Healthcare reform with a public option, the president says, I say the time is now for the president to draft his consession speech or his letter of resignation. That is what will satisfy the majority of the AMERICAN people. I do not count the Communist.

Ten Surprising Facts about American Health Care: http://www.ncpa.org/pub/ba649

And answers American should demand from our Naive Socialistic President:

1) Will your socialized single-payer health care system resemble Canada's and Britain's socialized single-payer health care systems? Or? Perhaps Cuba's? Yes or No?

2) Will YOUR socialized single-payer health care system render RATIONED CARE like Canada's and Britain's single-payer health care systems? Yes or No? And HOW?

3) Do the elderly suffer the most when health care is RATIONED? Yes or No? If No? Please explain HOW.

4) Will Socializing American Health Care, which represents 15% of our economy, be good for our economy and good for our health care which is the most advanced in the world? Yes or No? And HOW?

5) Will OBAMACARE render rationing that will cause average 18 month waits to see a specialist like up in Canada? Yes or No? And How?

6) Will OBAMACARE render an average 40 month wait to see an orthopedic surgeon like up in Canada? Yes or No?

7) Will socializing medicine via OBAMACARE put America's middle class one step closer to a 50% effective tax rate like up in Canada? Yes or No? And HOW?

8) America has always pumped out the best doctors, most health care innovations, and most health care related nobel prizes. Will dropping the existing system on it's head and socializing it upset this? Yes or No? And if no? Oh-oh! HOW?

Wake Up, America.

"I would define 46% of the popular vote as "nearly half.""

But 53% is a bigger half.

The election of Obama was tantamount to writing the obituary for a formerly great Nation. Obama repeatedly admitted during the campaign (but now blatantly lies about it) that he supports a single payer system, i.e. Socialized Medicine; and, his "Government Option" is designed to force private insurers out of the market in order to achieve precisely that goal. As Obama said: "I don't think we're going to be able to eliminate employer coverage immediately. There's going to be potentially some transition process..." Barney Frank then unashamedly admitted that Obama's "Public Option" was simply a Trojan Horse for surreptitiously introducing full blown Socialized Medicine. Which raises the question as to whether you can believe anything Obama says! With an overwhelmingly negative public response, the only question now is: In what disguised form will a stealth "public option" emerge? The American people have astutely spoken loud and clear that Socialized Medicine is anathema; but, Obama's Marxist psyche prohibits him from accepting free market reforms which should begin with shutting down illegal immigration and Tort Reform, both of which Obama unconditionally rejects. Obama's ACORN is busily registering illegals; and, Trial Lawyers are among his principal campaign contributors. But the most insidious part of Obama's plan is the coming bureaucratic denial of life saving procedures for the elderly. (Does an Obama proposed 500 Billion $ cut in Medicare reimbursements sound any alarms?) As Obama says: "Take an aspirin" and just wait to die. (( Pg 30: SEC. 123. HEALTH BENEFITS ADVISORY COMMITTEE of HC bill - THERE WILL BE A GOVERNMENT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benefits you get. AND, PG 430: SEC. 1233. ADVANCE CARE PLANNING CONSULTATION Lines 11-15 The Government will decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life.)) The elderly should revolt over Obama's health care proposals. He learned from his wife Michelle that considerable sums of health care funds could be saved by the practice of "patient dumping" which Michelle employed in Chicago. Facts that are precisely why Health Care legislation, that HAD TO BE DONE BY YESTERDAY, does not take effect until 2013, i.e. AFTER the next presidential election when voters will then be blindsided by a pending disaster. And, just remember that Obama and his Congressional colleagues have EXEMPTED themselves from compliance with their own proposed health care debacle. If left unrestrained, Obama will do irreparable harm to the American economy. Greg Neubeck

Social Security will isn't getting any raise. Yes, we need health care - but the government should not run any part of the health care program. The more the government is involved the more the cost, waste, and the more rights all Americans loss.

Tyler? Can you hear me?

Upon examination you're doing an OK job.

Peace.

I am truly disappointed in our President. He didn't have the guts to come to Ohio and talk to those of us, (the majority) who do not belong to the Union. It is common knowledge that the President is in the Union's pocket. Talking to them will do NOTHING to persuade the rest of us. The rest of us are against the bill and he knows it.

Vote out in 2010 and 2012 all who vote for this bill. Fix the job problem first! Get America back on track!

Even busier changing sides of the issue back and forth with whether the public should have an option! Why such an all-fired hurry to push this through? Could it be that there's even more pork in this than we have seen uncovered and he doesn't want us to know about it. What's to stop them from passing one bill and then revamping it to suit themselves?

When has the government ever succeeded at any program they've controlled? I'd say the biggest failure so far has been Social Security and the way they are sucking up the money they get instead of putting it back in the Trust Fund where it belongs.

They probably have big plans for all the money to support healthcare that they'll suck out of the taxpayers. Certainly they already have plans to pay ACORN out of it!

TRUE

Obama can't be in bed with big labor and represent "We The People", capitalism and privatization at the same time. Since he is obviously very much in bed with big labor, then it is obvious where he is on the rest of us, regardless of what lies he spews out of both sides of his mouth.

I liked the part where he said "the recovery plan is working." If an all time high unemployment rate is his idea of his recovery plan working, I don't want to be around when he says one of his plans are failing.

I also find it interesting that the longer the Health Care Reform/Plan is being debated and inspected by Congress and the public, the harder he pushes to make a quick decision. Kind of like the way he pushed the stimulus plan though before anyone had a chance to read it. I suspect that if too many people actually read H.R. 3200 and actually understand what they have read, it will go down in flames and that is Obama's worst nightmare to have people read and understand something he wants.

Knowledge is power and something that Obama does not want most in Congress and no American Citizen to have when it comes to his policies. We are just supposed to accept, like blind mice that what he says is all there is to know.

Why would Obama lie? Two reasons: (1) He is a Washington politician. (1) He is a lawyer.

How do you know he is lying? His libs are moving.

Seriously, when it comes to something as important as this Health Care Reform/Plan. There are 3 things to remember. (1) Accept nothing at face value. (2) Question (in depth) the real motive behind the method. (3) Demand proof that what they say is true.

Obama has awaken a sleeping giant in this country and we are the formerly silent majority. I suspect he will begin to understand the error of his ways in the few years he has left as POTUS although I believe it is already too late for him to save face.

DrWhoo

"BTW did you find the LINK for that Health Care CEO who got a $325m bonus yet? LMFAO!! Pathetic"

you are such a waste of time with , I TOLD YOU GOOGLE IT, I also supplied you with Suzyq's post with the list of insurance CEO'S are their salaries, also told you you could look up CEO bonus's on google. I believe you are so busy running your mouth you never read people s response, I don't believe I said wall street is a business I think the post you are referring to I said business model, either way semantics aside I stand by what I was saying, we have invested our wealth in this nation not in small business or business that actually make things but in a corrupted market place that sells paper dreams to everyone . And you sir have very little to offer to anyone discussion's , is your field of practice "berating" seems that every response you send to people who disagree has a disparaging remark, yet coming from you it is laughable.

I just looked at what I think you are talking about and I never said wall st. is a business , I said it has destroyed American business, nuance I know do you need a dictionary?

I would not believe this man (ScumBama) if there were an ora around him and angles were singing!

WAKE UP AMERICA! Vote everyone OUT in 2010 & 2012!!!!!

Time to face reality Hussein. People have caught on to you and you can kiss your a$$ goodbye. It will be a good ridance,

WAKE UP AMERICA! Vote everyone OUT in 2010 & 2012!!!!!

Who takes their places?

The Colonel-964761

NO, The right wing of politics has tried to put a divide in this nation they know no other way, when your ideas have proven failure and you have no new concepts, destruction seems to be your only path, The concept of playing on peoples fear and the distortions and lies have been the campaign style and operational governing style of a certain party for thirty eight years, whats really amazing is after all the lies and propaganda you are still the minority view in this country and that's a positive note to end on.

Latest Rasmussen Reports poll;

"Overall, 48% of voters say they at least somewhat approve of the President's performance. Fifty-one percent (51%) disapprove."

"The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey shows that 43% would vote for their district’s Republican congressional candidate while 36% would opt for his or her Democratic opponent. "

For those who dislike Rasmussen, remember that their election poll was the most accurate, while Gallup missed by a wide margin.

Why is everything obama wants URGENT, CRISIS, HURRY. He is the union whore. His transparency, and anti-lobbyist pledges were as empty as his promises.

YourNotTheBossOfMe

Those pensions would have been guaranteed by the government anyway, that was the point that companies are allowed to spend pension funds then dump them cost the government. As for GM in controlling the bankruptcy Investment banks like J.P. Morgan had to sit back, they held the property's and the tooling and the patients and were not willing to help keep the company alive because they made more money collapsing the industry and selling the patents and tooling, Their cooperation in any stabilizing this economic crisis has been nil, they took bailout money and received free loans from the fed and have made out like bandits, so the hell with their loss's on GM, no sympathy here for any of these to big to fail boys.

Forgot, the government had all other debtors on board only J.P.Morgan held out, that's why the controlled bankruptcy was a better idea. The unions have been giving up for the last five years and the companies even acknowledge it, only the Shelby's and Corkers wanted that blame to continue I wonder why ?

Diogenes--08
Could it be he was handed a nation headed into a depression, corruption in every facet of the federal government, and a political party who had control but were like the three blind mice.

palco YourNotTheBossOfMe "Those pensions would have been guaranteed by the government anyway"

You are not really right.

The pensions would have been taken over by the government, but so would the pension assets, and the government guaranteed pension would have been far less generous.

For example, GM's pension had $83 Billion in assets, and $96 Billion in "underfunded" liabilities if you used the pension agreement as the basis of estimating the liability. But if the government had to step in and take over, the government guarantee would probably have been less than the $83 Billion in assets they took over, so the government pension guarantee fund probably would have made a PROFIT on the plan if they took it over.

Since the union knew that the $13 Billion in unfunded liability ($96 - $83) would disappear in bankruptcy, and they would end up with a less generous pension plan and nothing else, they got Obama to make a special deal before GM's bankruptcy so they got a large % of the "Good GM" stock in return for the phantom "unfunded" liability portion that would have been wiped out in bankruptcy anyway, and got tp keep all of the pension assets too. The only ones who got screwed by this were the secured creditors, who were effectively replaced by the union without costing them a penny.

Just one more example of Obama taking care of the unions and screw a hundred years of bankruptcy law. The problem will come in the future because lenders will be less likely to lend money to unionized companies again because of this experience, so the government (taxpayers) will end up guaranteeing their debts in the future.

Why is everything obama wants URGENT, CRISIS, HURRY. He is the union whore. His transparency, and anti-lobbyist pledges were as empty as his promises.

Because he know that like health care if the people find out what he is up to they will oppose it. If you can't hide what you are doing, lie, misdirect and keep so many balls in the air that no one can tell which one is real.

Palco-granted there were problems, but his corrupt cabinet and czars don't even hide how crooked they are and have pride in being a communist and racist. At least Bush DIDN'T"T try to take away all of our fundamental rights. obama has become the very type of person that he and his wife hated. rich, blatantly spending when he claims we are in a recession. I will take Bush any day, any time!

The Democrats have majorities in the Senate and in the House. They can get 2-3 Republican votes without trying yet they cannot pass Health Care reform.

Why is that?

Because Americans do not want this. Some do but a large majority of people do not want a government option. Most Americans are for tort reform however. Tort reform would save the medical industry billions.

If you cannot pass a bill with majorities in both the House and the Senate then obviously what you are trying to pass is not worth passing. There is a reason that we have a system of checks and balances!

He's the President of the United States of America. If he wanted to do so, he could withdraw from Iraq and Afghanistan tomorrow. He won't because he hasn't the guts to do so. He stayed with Bush's Gates and Bernanke because he wouldn't have a clue as to potential replacements. He has no experience at executive leadership, and that's why I wouldn't dare to buy any stocks right now. No confidence!

Obama kisses up to union people and then stabs them in the back. Why do they fall for it? I think television and mass corporate media in general has really dumbed down the general public, they seem a lot more gullible than back years ago. In the 1950's or '60's union people would have demanded he actually come through with some concrete legislation favoring working people instead of just a lot of uplifting patter. The guy's a skilled con man that's for sure.

He's let millions of people get kicked out of their homes and at the same time bailed out all the super wealthy swindlers that engineered of the sub-prime fiasco. He took the real solution, single payer healthcare, off the table to please the insurance industry, and now he's even gone soft on the supposed "public option".

We needed someone like FDR (or better yet, Huey Long) but we got the political version of Bernie Madoff instead. What a fraud.

The Baron:

Considering the sad state of employees in all the industries you mentioned that Ron Bloom "helped" unions in, Auto, Airlines, Steel, I can see why Obama tapped him. He's obviously skilled at forcing management friendly "compromises" down the throats of union people partly by fooling employees that he's on their side.

Here's Ron Bloom's and the Democrats idea of "compromise":

Thief to victim: Your money or your life!

Ron Bloom and Dems: Let's compromise!

Thief: O.K. you give me your money and I'll give you your life

Ron B.: Deal!

DrWhoo

"BTW did you find the LINK for that Health Care CEO who got a $325m bonus yet? LMFAO!! Pathetic"

you are such a waste of time with , I TOLD YOU GOOGLE IT, I also supplied you with Suzyq's post with the list of insurance CEO'S are their salaries, also told you you could look up CEO bonus's on google. I believe you are so busy running your mouth you never read people s response, I don't believe I said wall street is a business I think the post you are referring to I said business model, either way semantics aside I stand by what I was saying, we have invested our wealth in this nation not in small business or business that actually make things but in a corrupted market place that sells paper dreams to everyone . And you sir have very little to offer to anyone discussion's , is your field of practice "berating" seems that every response you send to people who disagree has a disparaging remark, yet coming from you it is laughable.

I just looked at what I think you are talking about and I never said wall st. is a business , I said it has destroyed American business, nuance I know do you need a dictionary?

Palco,

LMFAO again!

So your lengthy diatribe about American business being already ruined by Wall Street was just senseless off-mark diatribe? LMFAO! Thanks for clarifying the obvious, OK? I'd look at your OWN pathetic again BTW, OK?

And go back to your $325m United Health CEO bonus, silly-boy. Facts say the guys comp was only 3.4 mill. You were over $320 Million OFF MARK, palco. Bravo!

LMFAO!!!

Wow.

This guy just loves the camera maybe he'll become an actor because he should win an Emmy for his acting too become our president, best con-artist I've every seen .......

Since most of these post demonizing Obama and past democrat presidents contain more satire than substance, let me try my hand, " for 28 of the past 41 years republicans have resided in the White House, presided over 4 wars, 3 recessions and all 28 years of deficit spending......And who of these demonizers have listed even one great accomplishment by any of the five recent republican presidents...........Let me see, "I am not a crook", "trickle down prosperity", "Read my lips"," Mission accomplished", .......failure, failure ,failure, failure, double failure

Chuck1968
I here you, good posts even if they collapsed you

Willowbrook

It was labor day ..da

As an investor and employer, this public option is a job killer. We are already outsourcing and not hiring and I need people. Surtaxes on labor to pay for this crap do not cut it.

Our outsource Sub-contractors know how to get around these higher costs. They employee a key Democratic voting block------------aliens.

Job killer.

Not to mention the 2011 uncertainty of the type of tax increases. We are also afraid of retroactive taxes-so no jobs for you.

The Unions helped create the largest middle class in history. Now they will be overseeing the largest poor population in history. While many of the things they did were beneficial to the American worker, their greed and hunger for power has contributed to the downfall of corporate America. A few recent examples of this start with the GM government take over. The largest part of outstanding liability for GM was retired employee pentions and health care benefits. Quiet little Fond du Lac, Wi almost had a major economic melt down when Union offficials didn't take Brunswick and Mercury Marine management at their word that if a contract concession package was voted down, Mercury Marine ( largest employer in FDL) would move their production operations and eventually their headquarters to stillwater ok. The membership voted it down and Mercury Marine planned to move until the City, County, and State interceeded with both Merc and the Union to allow another vote. The constant pursuit of higher wages and benefits with each negotiation and the threat of strikes has driven alot of manufacturing jobs to Mexico and abroad. The carpenters' union in Milwaukee was taken over by the Chicago area carpenters' union. They set pickets out on several jobs in the Milwaukee unannounced, threatening their own membership that had no Idea what was happening, to having their pensions revoked and being thrown out for crossing a picket line. These recent actions have been undermining business in our country for the last couple of decades all the while Union leadership enjoys their Crown Victoria company cars and salaries bled from the membership they are there to represent.

It was the Unions that supported Obama's victory, and it's only fitting that Obama should pay them back for their support. The only problem is that the payback will most likely kill unions in this country and create a huge gap between upper and lower class. The spending, ill prepared and unworkable proposed health care reform, The cap and trade bill, and the automatic tax increases as the Bush tax cuts expire will gut our economy. The president needs to step back and re-evaluate his direction before he runs our economy the rest of the way into the ground.

"Signs that read "Health care can't wait" dotted the crowd of several thousand people. Labor was a key base of support for Obama in his campaign for the presidency."

Since unions have "cadillac" health plans already, this sounds very contrived with their pre-printed signs, especially in comparison to the hand made signs of the opposition.

Obama has taken such good care of the unions, they just will support him if he says they should jump off cliffs like lemmings.

To palco, post # 1.120 - So what? The Unions are on the downswing since they are no longer helping labor and business in America. (Some sources say 25% of the workforce, others, 14%.) They are, without a doubt, the 2nd reason why so many jobs have left the country. The first being the govt. trade deals. The President's support of Unions shows how out-of-touch he is with the majority of America. He just went where the money was. He is in the pocket of those who are tearing down America. Gee, Change we CAN believe in! (NOT!!!!)

Yup he is just the fellow for Obama. Remember Obama had only held a job of community organizer and spent his short time in the senate running for president. Birds of a feather.

Some quick Facts about Ron Bloom, geniuses...

• Is currently employed by the Pittsburgh-based United Steelworkers union, which has 1.2 million working and retired members. Bloom has worked as a special assistant to the USW president since 1996 and his duties include helping the union affect corporate business restructuring, investments, bankruptcies and mergers. He is particularly known for working on deals related to recent steel industry bankruptcies. In many of these deals, the USW made considerable concessions in order to help steel companies stay afloat.

• Before taking a position with the steelworkers union, worked as an investment banker for 10 years, including as a vice president for Lazard Freres & Co. As a banker, he often worked on investment deals related to unions.

• In January 1990, Bloom and another Lazard banker quit the company to start their own boutique firm.

• Bloom is a 53 year-old New York native, has a bachelor's degree from Wesleyan University and an M.B.A. from Harvard Business School. According to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, he came from a proud union family that includes an aunt who was a leader in the teachers' union.

• After graduating from Wesleyan, he worked for the Jewish Labor Committee and the Service Employees International Union (SEIU). He reportedly decided to go to business school so he could help unions navigate the business world.

• Is known as both a fierce negotiator and a creative problem solver who helped shepherd the steel industry through a painful transition period. His knowledge of the financing, as well as the labor, side of negotiations is thought to be the reason Obama tapped him to be an adviser on auto issues.

• As a banker, played a major role in deals between airlines and unions in the early 1990s — facilitating employee givebacks in exchange for stock, for example.

• Helped put together a union contract with Goodyear Tire & Rubber Co. in 2003 that could shed light on how he might approach the car industry. The deal includes executive compensation limits and provisions to preserve American jobs.

I just can't help but wonder when something crazy is going to come to light with this guy. At least it sounds like he would have to be vetted and confirmed by congress.

did you not hear? obama lost a czar sunday, he had to hurry, uh we got to hurry and get another czar back in the white house. uh let there be no mistake there will be czars.

As I remember the Airlines and Goodyear both filed for bankruptcy,was this before or after Bloom worked out deals for them?..Sounds like he has always been on the Union payroll ,so why is that so great?

More importantly, once a member of SEIU always a member of SEIU. I hope someone digs deeper into Bloom's background.

Yeah, Bush wouldn't of hired someone to be one of his czar's unless they had a reference from Haliburton.

Do you guys know who the first president to pick a czar was? Ronnie Reagan 2001 - Drug Enforcement Czar. What goes around comes around!

Hilarious!

Trivia for Pubs like caw:

Did you all know it was a REPUBLICAN who initiated the Czars? Yep the theivin' GOP prez Nixon.

The idiots in the party of RED and Czars has the nerve to call Dems communist.

....and this is all so important anyway.

czars smars who knows?  All I do know is Obama is batting a thousand with his wonderful picks for czars and administration officials so far.  One is known by the company that they keep and this isn't showing much about the character of this current President.  The definition of a czar is " one having great authority"  sounds like a "caeser" to me. Oh yeah, we voted to have a king instead of a President didn't we!!!

The Baron - Perhaps you should not start your "argument" with a deragatory statement. Common sense should tell you that as soon as you make that statement, you've already lost the discussion, and the attention of the reader. Personal attacks will always cause you to lose the argument.

Apparently you missed this.

....and this is all so important anyway.

and your post is just as worthless.

oh yeah, we voted to have a king instead of a President didn't we!!!

Yep back in 2000 and again in 2004.

Being completely inept and stupid has never stopped the Republicans.

Personal attacks will always cause you to lose the argument.

Than the Repubs lost long ago... is that waht your trying to say?

Good ;ord where have you been.

The entire reason this country has been so f*cked up is becaue these GOP apologists are doing just that. Difference is... the puny wimps can't take it because when the attack comes from the Dems it's 99% of the time the actual truth.

That's why we keep seeing..."dont bring up Bush "they are trying to hide the truth.

Too late.

have a nice day!

So The Baron - where in that stream of "take you to the cleaners" jobs did he get experience in creating value? Seems to me his past has been about stealing value from others in trade for his flash... sounds like a perfect partner for Obama.

I don't think the republicans or democrats are very truthful, actually I would say they are almost always lying when their lips move or they are writing anything. It seems to me when the best argument either side can bring up is an attack on the other side there is little substance in their argument. As long as we identify ourselves as partisans and define victory as our side prevailing the country will suffer. Seizing $2.5 trillion dollars of the economy isn't about reform its about power. Does anyone seriously believe the cost of running a public option will be less than we are spending now? The CBO isn't buying it and for that matter neither are a large number of citizens. This is about accumulating power through propaganda and the followers and devotees to big government are the enablers and the rest of us will suffer for their partisan loyalty.

Carlos, your numbers are misleading, which weakens your argument. I would be disappointed to see you start spouting right wing rhetoric...we spend $2.5 trillion on health care which includes about 160 million people with private health insurance. the health care reform bill won't affect these people, except that insurance companies will find it more difficult to weasel out of paying claims. some things are as they appear. the drive for health care reform is about reducing inflation in health care spending, extending coverage to people who otherwise die an early death or get primary care at ER, at great expense to the public. It's about eliminating exclusions due to pre-exising conditions. To characterize as a mere power grab by "big government" smacks of right wing rhetoric, and not something coming from an independent thinker. there are plenty of reasons to oppose different aspects of the reform proposals from both sides, but please don't let your mind get twisted into a right wing pretzel.

Seriously, BMan, are you just f'n stupid? Maybe Obama should have hired you because apparently you DO know how to create manufacturing jobs, right? (How else would you know or assume this man with his experience doesn't know how to create these kinds of jobs?) Or are you just being an idiot and really have no idea wtf you are talking about?

I wonder...

Joe, I believe the intentions of the proposals from the partisan thinkers is for the government to control the entire amount of money. As for insurance companies weaseling out of paying claims my wife had cancer and exceeded the cap of payment we had on our policy the insurance company got together with the hospital and hospice and she received all the care necessary at no cost to us until he didn't need coverage any more. From my experience the companies weaseling out of paying is left wing drivel but I do know they deny claims and medicare reduces payments as does medicaid, I am a provider so I know a little about how the current government plans work. I also know we provide the service and many times do not get paid. I am certainly not married to either side but I do have a good idea of the intentions of the partisan crowd and their defenders. To characterize the "reform" plan that doesn't exist with predictable arguments that are confined to the proponents while dismissing my observations is hardly objective. The truth is we won't know the repercussions of the government plan or options for some time so the truth is murky now. If we cannot change carriers and if the private carriers are taxed to pay for their vision then the private option will be dead in short order. The devil will be in the details and as of now its about platitudes not reality. Pardon me if I don't trust either party or their followers, experience teaches me they are biased hypocrites who desire power. Maybe your experience is different than mine, so be it.

Carlos. Great post man.

I think sometimes people get so caught up in their admiration of Obama they fail to look at the details. And that this bill will evolve far after it has been passed. Into what remains to be seen.

But people need to first remember, Obama is, first and foremost, a politician. Very much like every other one who has come before him. Why people see him as being so different, I still haven't figured out.

Colonel, I don't care which party it is I am opposed to more government. In my view the last administration was inept and violated our rights, so there is little likelihood I would support this one essentially doing the same things. Republicans, democrats it doesn't matter, in my opinion they are corrupt power hungry scoundrels. As a resident of Illinois, I have seen the President and his advisors in action. Maybe I am a bit harsh on the great reformer but I haven,t seen any evidence of bipartisanship, reform or a push for good government in the past and don't hold out much hope for seeing any in the future.

carlos, I would agree that a lot of liberals trust the government to handle their health care money than private insurers, so you are at least partly correct...in my case, the insurance companies are weaseling out by excluding my wife's pre-existing condition from coverage, so my hostility and suspicion toward health insurance companies is based on personal experience, not someone else's political dogma. I do agree with Obama that health care reform is an urgent national priority and that reducing waste and fraud and inefficiency are needed, along with providing an option for those with pre-existing condition. I disagree on tort/malpractice reform, as I think it will help reduce costs. And you are certainly correct in the fact that we don't have the details yet. I don't necessarily agree that politicians are motivated by desire for power for power's sake. In their own minds they believe they are doing what's right. From their perspective their motivation is pure. Bush truly thought invading Iraq was the right thing to do. He was obviously wrong. Obama truly wants to reform health care driven by compassion for those without it. He believes the public option is the best way. He may be wrong. Like Johnson and the Great Society. I don't think Johnson was driven by lust to increase the government but rather by a compassionate desire to right the wrongs of slavery and discrimination. He was obviously only partially successful.

Joe, if you believe in the motives of politicians then you will be okay with the actions of the current group of "leaders". I am glad for you, I on the other hand have little confidence in their motives so I will continue to have my doubts.

choochoo-1167113

wall.al, you're about eight years behind. You're thinking of Bush, not Obama. It was Bush who started all of the things you are talking about.

Bush may have got the ball rolling on deficit spending, but Obama, Congress, and the Senate, are tyring to finish us off! His spending is out of control, his payoffs to his buddies, is bankrupting us all(what do you expect when it cost $3/4 of a billion dollars to put"super star" into office?). You say Bush is a liar? Now that's the pot screaming at the kettle! But you all believe he has OUR best interest at heart, that's what that leech is hoping for.

YES WE CAN! = Mantra for the brain dead

Or walk the war like Bush did and walk us into the ground.

he is walking the war walk there has been more us casualties per day since he has been in office than ever before!

i thought he was gonna get us out of the wars bring our troops home immediately. where are they? still there and sending more!

dal... Since you seem to think Obama isn't responsible for anything... is that how you live your life also, always blaming others, never taking responsibility?

That's a rhetorical question by the way.......

Dal,

He is walking the war--he's increasing the Afghan war as we speak which is even more fruitless than Iraq was and will cost scores more useless deaths than Iraq . I guess muslims in Iraq are bigger threats than muslims (that are terrorists ) in Afghanistan. Right Dal?

He is walking the war--he's increasing the Afghan war as we speak which is even more fruitless than Iraq was and will cost scores more useless deaths than Iraq . I guess muslims in Iraq are bigger threats than muslims (that are terrorists ) in Afghanistan. Right Dal?

We are just trying to finish what Bushie & the oil co's started but this time with our reasons and resourses in the RIGHT country against a true threat.

If you don't think this is about oil SH then you might want to check out where and when the next big oil pipeline is being finished and who stands to gain if they control its' access and the country it's going through.I guess you think the Russians were fighting the Taliban before us just because at that time we supported Bin Laden and the Taliban against them don't you. Google that and see what you find out.

I think Obama is effectively stuck in Iraq.

Consider this.

After the '79 war in Afghanistan, when the Soviet troops were driven out, the Afghanistani nation were abandoned by America. They were left with a country ravaged by war, no school or healthcare or effective form of govt. The Islami mujaheddeen (previously supported by USA, including Osama bin Laden) were left with their guns and missiles, and a country ravaged by many years of war. So it was very easy for them to take over the country, eventually giving birth to Taliban, becoming a breeding ground for terrorists.....resulting in Sept 11, 2001.

So if Obama were to similarly abandon Iraq today, America would be setting itself up for more terrorist problems in the future. i.e history would repeat itself.

However, America needs to get out of this war, because it can no longer afford it.

Looks bad.....

We are just trying to finish what Bushie & the oil co's started but this time with our reasons and resourses in the RIGHT country against a true threat.

Wow just WOW. These a$$holes suddenly can't remember the terrorists they kept bringing up ad nauseum for the past eight yrs defending their royal a$$hats Bush and cheney.

NOW they want to know what the threat is? ...sh*t I really didn't know the right wingers were THAT stupid. Sad sad sad.

You were all "proud to be an American" ... blah blah blah after 911

What happened ...was bin laden was caught? nope (another Bush / GOP failure)

Oh yeah, A liberal took office and now your going to try and make it his war..

Hey Chuck, Bin Laden slipped thru Bill Clinton's fingers as well. From what I recall he had 8 yrs, too. And if history repeats itself this will end up Obama's War. Like the Viet Nam War started by another Liberal President Lyndon Johnson in order to get elected in'64. Ask anyone nowadays about Nam and they'll blame Nixon. So what's your point? Bush was wrong and currently so is President Obama. Didn't your mama teach you 2 wrongs don't make a right?

Hmm!

Yep, He is doing exacty what he said he was going to do in Iraq and Afganistan.

Draw the troops down in Iraq - honoring the previous adminstration agreement with Iraqis to be out by Dec 2011.

Step-up the number of troops in Afghanistan.

Is it not truly amazing that a freshmen enter college has never known a time when"has not asked is war with Iraq worth it?

Obama is bringing the Iraqi occupation which he inherited to an end. Unfortunately Bush's war cost the US $2 Trillion with the GOP minions cheering the way. Now all of a sudden they've become cost conscious and are trying to prevent millions of Americans from being able to get health insurance. Real strong values, that bunch.

fenderbluesjr (I played a Jaguar in the 60's) is right about Afghanistan becoming Obama's war. Iraq is forever Bush's but unless Obama can get us out of Afghanistan, it will become his and if so, may be his undoing. It has been proven over and over that the cost of occupying a country and fighting insurrection and nation building is extremely high and not something Americans are willing to do for long. We need to take a different approach to protecting ourselves from terrorists other than occupation of Afghanistan.

Apology for second post last sentence should read

Is it not truly amazing that a freshmen enter college has always known a time when someone has always been asking: “Was Iraq worth a war?”

Pay attention Americans, while we bicker about the past and of wars - Ahmadinahjad has defiantly set the terms for meeting with the U.S. saying sure we can meet and talk, but we're moving forward on the nuclear front no matter what you say, and by the way if we do get together make sure the press is present. And on the other front, Chavez has already said he will support Ahmadinahjad to lessen the threat of sanctions. And wait, what did N.Korea just announce? And here we are, a nation severely divided. We've got to pull it together and stop tearing each other down. Regarding the unions, I know they've done some good things in the past when we had a strong manufacturing base - but things have changed and it seems to be more of a political base that is trying to strong arm our country. Our economy (70% of jobs) rests on the success of small businesses.

Everyone seems so set on blaming this side or that for deficits, over spending, wars, etc. No one seems to want to put any productive ideas on the table. WE ARE ALL RESPONSIBLE FOR LETTING THINGS GET TO WHERE THEY ARE! Now let's curb spending, let the tax cuts expire to increase income, find some meaningful and workable solutions to the cost of healthcare without creating a government jobs program that will suck the life out of this country, cut pork, outlaw lobbiests, find Bin Laden bring him back here try him and hang him as a criminal, and try to get ourselves back on our feet. Useless bickering gets us nowhere, and quite frankly I'm sick of other countries snickering behind their hand when Ma Clinton shakes her finger and threatens to punish them for being bad boys.

"We" are not responsible for the fact there isn't a decent politician in Washington ,nor their actions!

Republican Ensign and Sandford gave theirs up for adultery and not even a thank you to us for paying for them to have sex.

Dal,,,at least they got some fond memories for their funds,while the Tax payer just gets bent over and not even Kissed.

dal has no useful comments. Typical liberal - can only call names and change the subject.

I have an Idea,let all those who want to pay more taxes,for everyone to have health care,do so. I am sure all the Democrats will step up, that is if they are paying their Taxes,and if the costs goes up then raise their taxes. Obama said it will not increase the budget,So let the people who are willing to pay more taxes pay for it, if it does.

That way those of US who work for a living,and want to spend our money on our families and ourselves can,and those who want to pay more taxes can.

Dal,,,at least they got some fond memories for their funds,

Yay! more GOP "values" They don't want to help fund health care for all Americans but they are plenty fine funding GOP adulterers, and they get off on it ew!

In case you hadn't figured it out, we are all paying for the uninsured. No one dies because of lack of insurance. The already requires hospitals to provide care whether or not the patient can pay. That is why people who can't pay or don't want to pay for insurance go to the emergency room for strep throat instead of a doc-in-a-box clinic, costing the hospital hundreds of dollars which is then built into thebill for people who actually have insurance and pay their hospital bills.

IMO, there should be universal insurance, a base plan which all insurance companies doing business in the US must offer to anyone who comes through the door, administered by private insurance companies and co-ops, but underwritten by the government. It would be paid for by adding the cost per person to the annual tax return.

Interstate competition for insurance business would also create larger insurance pools.

The current state by state regulation of health insurance is one of the biggest problems with our health care system. It is not only inefficient because it forces large insurance companies to duplicate administration 50 time over, but it also forces plan participants into small state pools which results in higher costs.

Oops, left out the law that requires hospitals to serve anyone that comes through the door: the EMTALA

..starting with the last Administration for allowing this mess to have occurred and expecting Obama to fix it in 8 months...

Baron...when are you liberals going to do the research and see who really started this mess? Are all Democrats so stupid to think that Bush was at fault?

the baron

you need to do your research!

the economy was doing fine UNTIL nancy pelosi and her retards took over the senate, go back and see WHEN the economy started its down turn.

Don't show me the facts. If it is known that Franks and Reid along with Dodd and Greenspan kept lying about the Fannie and Freddie situations and helped ramrod the housing bubble down America's throats against the repeated efforts of many other Repubs and Dems in office at the time then these guys wouldn't have a leg to stand on. These guys messiah, Obama is more Republican in nature than most any Republican on the issues of economy and finance from the old school and are trying their best to wipe out the middle class of this country to the benefit of themselves. Why else would Obama want Ron Blooms vast knowledge of union and big business interests on his team? I'd make a huge bet that the welfare of the unions is not one of his priorities high on his agenda, though he might say so. It's been shown already that the excuse" We didn't realize the severity of the issue when we inacted this program" is acceptable by the vast American electorate.So that's what we'll hear from the clowns on their policies too.

Stormer ,,, and are you so stupid to think that none of this was Bush's fault? That is the biggest problem I have with the right wing. The lack of reason. While I will gladly concede that the economy is still being mishandled, I can look at the big picture. I think Bush was clear in his hatred for the middle class. He said "I want a nation of haves and have mores." In his position as "the decider" he got his two class society, he just forgot about giving anything to the bottom.

Here you are.... for those above in denial "If it is known.....(Dems)... kept lying about the Fannie and Freddie"

Proof: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=fd4_1225048683

The Democrats clearly gave them a free pass and thus contributed greatly to the economic situation we are in today. It, in large part, could have been avoided if the auditors report was taken seriously instead of the Dem scumbags giving them a pass.

This video should infuriate all Americans.

It was not the government that bundled subprime and prime mortgages together and then sliced them into derivatives and sold them on the open market.

The government did not set up this house of cards, that came falling down when NO ONE could LOCATE the individuals that were defaulting on a specific mortgage. If the industry had been able to locate and isolate the bad loans as a whole entity, none of the mortgage debacle would have happened.

The government did not come up with credit swaps to sell as insurance against loss in the derivatives market.

That was completely the work of big business "wizards" and deregulations per Phil Gramm 1circa 1999.

The next bubble being created now is life insurance loans being bought up and bundled as securities. I can see it now, a lot of phony insurance policies bought and sold, and life insurance premiums rising... We need this crap regulated, Wall Street is setting up the stage for the next great ripoff. Or perhaps we will be having life insurance death panels offing old people who are being scammed out of thier insurance for pennies on the dollar.

True,

It was not the gov't that came up with these schemes but it was the gov't and the SEC and the Treasury that chose to ignore them and failed to properly put regulations and restrictions on them knowing point blank that what was coming ,if it continued, would come and it was the great Democratic gods of Franks and Dodd along with a few others that constantly lied about Frannie and Freddie and blocked any regulation of the two entities for the so-called sake of getting everyone rich or poor alike into a house. Now they've crashed the whole system on this mess and other messes they chose to ignore knowing their outcome just to buy votes to continue their own careers with no respect whatever for the millions that they put out in the street and caused to lose their homes that wouldn't have. They ought to be tried for treason with many others still in Congress and still raping the American public.

Dakota, it's nice to see that someone understands what happened. Whenever we look the other way the crooks find a new way to fleece us. This was the biggest fleecing in history. An these idiots still parrot things like you see constantly in the Wall Street Journal "just let the free market do it's job", yeh robbery.

Dakota,

I agree with most of what you said but it was the government in the form of Republicans and their ever-present "deregulation" motto that ALLOWED it to happen.

And for people who say it started when the Dems took control, seriously, you surely are more logical than to think timing actually equals cause.

Democrats ran Fanny and Freddy. (one even worked on NOBama's campaign!), and democrates blocked all attempts to reign them in. It's their fault, period. This whole mess started back when Carter decided that everyone should own a home. Frank actually recently called it a right.

In case anyone hasn't noticed, he is trying to force banks to make risky loans again to reinflate the bubble. These guys will do anything to get elected, including flushing the country down the tubes!

I had thought that Obama was going to declare at his political rally with his union buddies that 30 million drivers were not covered by auto insurance and that this was cause for a single-payer auto insurance legislation sponsored by Uncle Sam.

Dakota Kyle

It was not the government that bundled subprime and prime mortgages together and then sliced them into derivatives and sold them on the open market.

The government did not set up this house of cards, that came falling down when NO ONE could LOCATE the individuals that were defaulting on a specific mortgage. If the industry had been able to locate and isolate the bad loans as a whole entity, none of the mortgage debacle would have happened.

The government did not come up with credit swaps to sell as insurance against loss in the derivatives market.

That was completely the work of big business "wizards" and deregulations per Phil Gramm 1circa 1999.

Yet, it is the responsibility of the Government, to REGULATE industry, your going to try and lie to everyone, and say Uncle Sam had no clue to what was going on? You see, that's why Americans are so pissed off, they know we have been had! Obama is on a quick downfall, and thanks to Bush and his failed reign, the people are no longer a tolerant bunch! We the people are tired of , lying, cheating, money grubbing hacks, hell bent on ruining our once great Nation, this includes "Wonder Boy"! You had better start listening to the people Mr. President! We grow weary of the same old business as usual in D.C. And yes, we are watching.

Yeah Bush lead us to a trillion dollars in debt..PROVEN! That is not just talk like you gave.

And quadrupling it is OK,You must get off the Kool-aid,your living in the past.

yeah and big ear dumbo more than trippled down on that debt!

put that in your pipe and smoke it!

dal..... there you go again, driving while looking in the rear-view mirror. Obama isn't responsible for anything is he?

How can you keep squawking Bush, last eight years, etc. and totally ignore that the chosen one has quadrupled the debt and double deficit spending already?

And somehow what Bush did in spending for bailouts justifies going hog-wild and doing the same thing only multiple fold. What screwed-up, failed logic.

Wait a minute, are you advising the president, he uses similar flawed logic in most of his decisions to date

Only an idiot thinks you can spend yourself out of debt.

If the orator in chief had any leadership skills we would not be in this mess with health car because people would have a clear view of what is planned whether they like it or not. A 1000+ page bill that leaves much of the important stuff TBD is just asking for trouble.

Bingo, which makes Obama, the worlds biggest idiot, especially for following the advice of Congress!

How about a selling a war based on false intelligence? Trillion dollars of our money in a sandlot.

How much is Obama costing Us now with his war,and how many American lives Since he took Office.?

We are still operating on Bush's budget until the fiscal year ends on 9/30/09.

http://mediamatters.org/research/200907140057

Well it was about 4000 lives before Obama took office and most of them were lost in Iraq. Remember Iraq, the country that attacked us, harbored the terrorist and was just about to nuke us?

Suckers.

When did Iraq attack America?

Dave,,,Bush refuse to sign the 2009 budget,because it contained too much Pork,But Obama could not wait. I really wish you would do some research for yourself and stop listening to Olberman and Madcow for your news.

Bush's final full budget is for the 2009 fiscal year, which begins on Oct. 1. It proposes spending $3.1 trillion, up 6 percent from projected spending of $2.9 trillion in the current budget year. It was the extention he did not sign. Read the article you just might "get smarter"

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22990613/

Dave in Ma.

Yes we are, but Bush's budget didn't include 3/4 of a trillion dollars in spending that for the most part won't help the economy for antoher 1 to 2 years at best, if at all! Also Bush didn't propose creating another government program that will spend close to another 2 trillion over ten years and will probably sink our economy as a whole. If you want the future that is coming then get in line and sign up for welfare and foodstamps because there won't be anywhere to find work. Unless of course you head to Mexico.

Some facts about Ron Bloom, since Conservatives LOVE to mouth off before doing any research ...

• Is currently employed by the Pittsburgh-based United Steelworkers union, which has 1.2 million working and retired members. Bloom has worked as a special assistant to the USW president since 1996 and his duties include helping the union affect corporate business restructuring, investments, bankruptcies and mergers. He is particularly known for working on deals related to recent steel industry bankruptcies. In many of these deals, the USW made considerable concessions in order to help steel companies stay afloat.

• Before taking a position with the steelworkers union, worked as an investment banker for 10 years, including as a vice president for Lazard Freres & Co. As a banker, he often worked on investment deals related to unions.

• In January 1990, Bloom and another Lazard banker quit the company to start their own boutique firm.

• Bloom is a 53 year-old New York native, has a bachelor's degree from Wesleyan University and an M.B.A. from Harvard Business School. According to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, he came from a proud union family that includes an aunt who was a leader in the teachers' union.

• After graduating from Wesleyan, he worked for the Jewish Labor Committee and the Service Employees International Union (SEIU). He reportedly decided to go to business school so he could help unions navigate the business world.

• Is known as both a fierce negotiator and a creative problem solver who helped shepherd the steel industry through a painful transition period. His knowledge of the financing, as well as the labor, side of negotiations is thought to be the reason Obama tapped him to be an adviser on auto issues.

• As a banker, played a major role in deals between airlines and unions in the early 1990s — facilitating employee givebacks in exchange for stock, for example.

• Helped put together a union contract with Goodyear Tire & Rubber Co. in 2003 that could shed light on how he might approach the car industry. The deal includes executive compensation limits and provisions to preserve American jobs.

So how many jobs did he create?

Baron I have to give you credit for giving it the old school try, but anything close to reasonable debate really has no place in the Party of Fear.

I asked a question that Baron cannot answer, I don't care about his union experience, sure Ron Bloom has saved jobs. He wont create jobs this country has lost for along time now. I live in the rust belt, I have seen what these unions do to companies, heck I was a union worker for 16 yrs. Fear doesnt have anything to do with it.

Dorko1 Did he lose the jobs? Those jobs were gone over a year now but no solution comes without seeking an answer so if this guy does his job it might make a difference unless your a Republican then it does not matter who it is doom is coming for us all.

dal ...I remember the airlines and Good year filing Bankruptcy,so i guess he did cost someone their job.

Folks the jobs have all gone to third-world countries. The corporations have their headquarters here and their labor force in Mexico, Central America, China and South East Asia.

I'm a software engineer in the US and my job is to lead a team of software engineers in Hanoi Vietnam (that's right, not a clothing sweat shot). There are payed roughly 1/6th of what I am. Now would I like to live in the US on that wage?

Do you think I should form a union so we can exert some force here, or should just let all the jobs go and become a third world country ourselves?

I guess he should hide like Bush did.

That would be nice Dal, Actually he should just go away.

Maybe he should. It worked for Bush. The only problem is while he golfed and a hurricane killed over a thousand people it would have been nice for a little speech but I guess he was too busy flying over oil riggs to make shure they were OK for Haliburton.

dal,,the Democratic Mayor and Democratic Governor sat on their can while Bush offered troops but they said no and waited 3 days to accept any federal help. why is it you Democrats have such short memories is it because you have such lousy education?

dal, you live in Louisiana?

The loss of life in New Orleans is to be blames on those that lost their lives. They were told. Many times they were told. You are below sea level, you will flood. Get Out. They didn't. Some say they didn't have a way to get them out. I say I saw 50 school buses left to the flood. The city should have done more BEFORE the storm instead of whining after.

complaints are the first signs of real change.

complacency kills.

that certainly was proved for 8 years............

True, we complained for eight years with Bush and prison abuse, torture, wiretapping, false war, trillions of dollars in Republican spending...that was bad change.

go ahead,,

stay complacent.

be our guest at the next election.

you will be sitting in the back row.

Corsair same old fear mongering. Has not changed for some in eight years. The only difference is that we actually do not have much to fear from except right extremists and militia groups. I think the next election you better sit up front to be the first one at the box of tissues.

You'll likely eat those first two words in your post #14, with the door-mat / appeaser in chief we've got.

As far as the recession, yes, they normally do go away / subside on their own, even without a 787 BILLION dollar Democrat pet projects / spending bill.

You know this week VP Biden says things are great / the stimulus bill is working better than expected, less than 12 hours later the new unemployment numbers come out....... UNEMPLOYMENT AT A 26 YEAR HIGH !! What's that?

And yet the mindless still chant "Yes We Can"..... Yes we can ruin this country quicker than anyone thought humanly possible.

How can the economy be recovering when we are still losing jobs? You Obama lovers have absolutly no common sense and cannot think for your selves.

joe shmoe: If you would understand economics. And what most of the economists say, is that even after the recession starts to heal, jobs are the last thing to come back. Sometimes it takes a long time. There were several articles about this same thing yesterday and the day before, right here on MSNBC>

verno,

That is true. However, many on here don't want to think or realize that there are signs of the economy turning because that would mean (gasp!) President Obama is doing a really good job with it.

Fools wait till all the unemployement runs out,and then we will see,how many jobs Obama's Stimulis has created.

MSNBC also said that this will be the mother of all jobless recoveries. In other words, wall street will do great, Gates and Soros and Buffet will do great, Gore will do great, but working stiffs will wait in bread lines.

And you thought democrats were for the little guy. Suckas!

Funny how Bush never had any policies yet Obama has came out with some whether you agree with them or not. Oh wait Bush had Medicare which he failed to fund costing us millions. And then we built a bunch of schools in Iraq for a trillion dollars devastating our economy. Is that the work because I will take the carrot.

Consair when Republicans come up with solutions instead of crying then I will buy it but that is all snake oil you are selling.

That's why we elected Obama. To change...

that just makes the point of how brainwashed you really are.

Oh dal: Guess you never heard of the Bush Doctrines??? Get Off The Kool-Aid...They just might have kept your $ss Safe for the last 7 years..

I know for a fact that Sara Palin never heard of the Bush Doctrines: When asked what she thought about them she damn near swallowed her tongue.

wrong verno: Palin knew...Good old Charlie Gibson didn't and was incapable of asking a coherent question...Get your facts Straight...Same old LIBERAL Crap just keeps on spinning, do yourself a favor and at least pick-up a new spin...its old news..

Corsair that was just plain unacceptable.

dal,,when Republicans have come up with fix it ideas the Democrats just ignore them, Why will the Democrats not allow the Health insurance companies to compete across state lines? why are the Democrats so afraid of TORT refom to bring down the cost of health insurance and Mal-practice costs?

Socialists? Like voting for a bailout socialists? We can include Republicans in that route. Pushing his agenda to...Bush did it in 1991, Reagan....your are a hypocrit.

dal,,,you have no idea what your talking about,AGAIN. Bush never had an instruction plan to go with his address,to be taught by the teachers to the students.Neither has any other past president....

You would think Obama would have more to worry about the Economy than speaking to the schoolkids. I wonder who is pulling his strings he seems to be marching to someone else's tune.

Michele, CHANGE is HERE and it is absolutely fabulous to be FREE! Wake up. Look around. The old bushie crows are whining and moping. They are in a snake pit biting everyone else and spewing venom. They are jealous, sorry losers. They are the minority. Our president is listening to the majority of us. Those of us who are being discriminated against by the big insurance companies due to our illnesses and injuries will not be rejected for coverage in the future. Those of us who's premiums have been skyrocketing at enormous rates will, in the future, be able to have affordable premiums. Those of us who are elderly and/or disabled will not be tortured and killed by policies of rationing in the interest of healthy, young employee-robots. Wake up, Michele, and give thanks. Now it's time for the scoundrel corporations to stop evading their responsibilities and bring the jobs back home. It's time for the big companies to again hire AND PROVIDE HEALTH INSURANCE to America's workers! We will win the health care reform war and move on to remodel the existing government run health care programs. Isn't it wonderful? YES WE CAN!

No you can't. Obama doesn't get it and neither do you. The majority of the American people don't want this kind of change and you are in the minority.

pizat, pull yourself out of that depressing snake pit mentality. We have one of the greatest presidents of our time!

Yep, greatest spender, greatest socialist, greatest liar, greatest incompetent. He will DOUBLE our national debt single handed, he is trying to completely take over the health care industry, he has repeatedly lied about his health care agenda, and his appointments have been appalling.

He put a tax cheat in charge of treasury! He put a communist in charge of green jobs! I could go on and on. Bottom line, this guy needs to go, if not 2011 then 2012 for sure.

Choo Choo...please stop the elicit drug use for one second and wake the F_CK UP. I am from Germany and even in our country the mood is quickly shifting to anti-American again.....I am sorry but I think a good old revolution is in hand...Just hope they don't take away your rights like they did our in WWII then you'll have a pretty hard time when they come knocking on your doors.

I take it by your post your a Karl Marx follower?

Ludicrous.

ellie, you must be one of the ugly faced domestic terrorists who was screaming and shouting at the town hall meetings. What insurance company bussed you in? Did they pay you to make such a fool of yourself? Shame on you.

Surf

We have given GM and Chrysler 70 Billion to boot

Outrage here don't fit the "It's all Bush's fault" line. Makes a good argument for the term republicrat though which is what this Admin is.

There is only one political party in Washington today, that is the party of how much money can we scam citizens for and give it to our special interest buddies to get reelected party. Keep the politicians who do the will of the people and get rid of the rest.

ray-392483: With our economy in present state why should the citizens tax money being taken to try to save these company's allow this....Remember the stimulus, Nowhere did I hear we were going to send/invest this money in Gov/Union company's being moved to foreign country's with us just keeping enough to fix Pot Holes in roads and special pork projects. America Needs These JOBs & industry. This is what OBAMA promised...

This is Crazy and has to be Stopped...And Yes the Right People in Our Government can put a Stop to This....2010 Vote To Make The Difference

The Middle Class is Being Dismantled by Deflating wage scales--- The American Standard of Living is getting POORER, This is what the powers that be want !!!The Jobs are NOT COMING BACK --- Better get "Skilled"at Being Poor Because A Return to Debt Fueled "Prosperity" is a Illusion !!!!!! America---Stick a Fork in it !!!!!!!!!!!!

raymond- The Middle Class is being Dismantled....No the Middle Class is being Used, Manipulated, and played for palms all part of the far lefts transition for this country's move toward Socialism or Communism...Straight out of the Marx and Engels playbook.. These People Truly Hate America and want to destroy it.

Wave the flag all you want----I'll Meet you under the Bridge---But there will be a waiting line becuase all the good things are already TAKEN !!!

raymond: Sorry I bothered, what a defeatist attitude, you can set and wait in line or get out and take a stand to make a difference in the direction this Country is being taken...The Choice is YOURS at least for Now..Don't set on the Sidelines to long...

Defeatist?!! Try NIHILISTIC --- Do you REALLY BELIEVE in those Lying Thieves of BOTH Parties???!!! Voting for Either of them Again won't get you different results !!! BOTH of them consider the working Middle Class to be Expendable--More Money for them.

Obummer needs to attack IRAN instead of the American Health care System ; Get your Nose out of American Health Care you lil Duffus ! American Labor was doing fine before you and will be doing fine after you are History ! Sit Down Shut your Face and STOPPITT !

American labor was doing fine before Obama??? You do realize we starting losing jobs big time starting in early 2007 don't you? How did Obama cause that?

Obama was part of the Democratic controlled Congress that helped start that

dont bother trying to explain things to these morons they will never get it so dont waist your time acknowledgeing them.

Let's get rid of the right in 2010! The right is wrong for America!

It's the left that's flushing us down the drain, it's a socialist that will DOUBLE our national debt single handed. It's the left that is losing in the polls because of their attempted fascist take over of health care. It's the socialists that have to go in 2010!

What do you think the other car manufacturers of the world are ? They / All other countries Governments Financed and controled the auto industries in every other country ; Butt this is AMERICA AND OBUMMER Peasloosir and Reid and Boxer and the Demo Nazis lil regime ; Really Need to get out of Private Industries ; America has allways aided the Major Business Groupes in their Financial times of Need ; Without ever taking control of their Businesses ; STOPPITT NOw !! This is a Democracy do you even know what it "Means" anymore ? From the actions of late ; you are not Americans at all ! Zieg Heil you lil scum bags ! Dummitt sit down shut you face ! Now !

cawfarmer: So would you buy a ford. Just curious. Because they have the same union as Chrysler and GM.

hell no i would not buy a ford! it will be some foreign job as bad as i hate to say it. and i am not real sure what i will do for the big trucks i need. i guess i will get a larger truck than i actually need and go to a 18 wheeler.

Democrats will win in 2010! The right is wrong for America!

one of the few bloogs not put here by the republican party!And you will most probabley buy a toyota because its made in a republican state even tho the money goes back to japan

I'll never buy another UAW built product as well. The unions have ruined yet another American industry. I thought I would always buy and American car, my how times have changed.

The right wing nuts are wrong for America! Vote Democrat in 2010!

you are right we do have some bigot people in the right wings of this hospital

I do have to laugh at the continued lie of "tax and spend liberals". It's been shown time and again the Republicans grow governement more and add more to the debt than anyone.

House Democrats' health care reform bill would create a mind-boggling "web of bureaucracy," Republican critics charged Wednesday as they sought to block Democrats from hastily passing a costly and sweeping health package on orders from President Obama.

Stressing his point, House Minority Leader John Boehner unveiled a dizzying flow chart that he said would represent how health care coverage would look under the plan being pushed by House Democrats.

The chart shows the president and Congress at the top, with dozens of agencies and officials responsible for various slices of the health care program underneath.

The suggestion inherent in the chart is that the health care system would grind to a near-halt under the Democrats' plan.

"If anybody thinks that all of this bureaucracy is needed to fix our health care system, I plainly disagree," Boehner said. "What this is going to do is ration care, limit the choices that patients and doctors have and really decrease the quality of our health care system."

Estimates of the House Democrats' plan range from $1 trillion to $1.5 trillion over 10 years, with much of the cost offset by a surtax on the wealthy. As Republicans railed against the package, a Senate committee voted on another version of a health care overhaul, becoming the first congressional panel to do so.

( for those of you who cannot count this means higher prices for everyone)

"The proposal amounts to a government takeover of the American economy," Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind., said of the House version, pledging that his party would oppose it.

But Democrats, and especially Obama, are set on passing a health care overhaul soon -- whether Republicans are on board or not.

Obama talked about his health care goals Wednesday afternoon, as his allies on Capitol Hill press to pass a bill through both chambers in the coming weeks.

I asure you I have talked to many pissed off people from republicans to once liberals and they are not on board with this horrifying failed plan the rest of the world is talking about getting rid of.

Well said.

I cannot fathom how anyone thinks that the government is efficient in any exercise, especially with all the little beaurocracies that spring up to process anything.

It can only be selfishness, short sightedness and pure greed that keeps this idea going.

The Dems basically have the tip of the dragon's tail they are trying to pull through a mousehole, and all along trying to sell everyone that they know what they are doing.

Sandy Shores

Thanks for the example of creative writing, as a novelist you will probably do well. To quote John Boehner as an authority on anything except his own obstructionist agenda is kind of silly, but nevertheless entertaining, expecting anybody to think it was valid. Also, 1 trillion over 10 years is 100 billion per year, much less than what was needed to save the economy from the active neglect of the right. And also, who would quote as authoritative the opinion of someone like Pence. The assertion that the rest of the world is getting rid of is pure fantasy. Keep what you're doing, non-fiction is not your forte.

The political right is wrong for America!

americancretins

maybe you need to watch obama's speech to the school children.

i believe it will do you good, you should have stayed in school a little longer so you could learn to read and write. go back and try to read that jumbled up crap you wrote.

up at the top of the little box you are typing in, is a button {ABC} that is not the tv station, it will actually tell you if you spelled the words right.

Let's keep the sorry losers that way. The political right is wrong for America.

i agree a bunch of losers that have no sence

keith, get your belly off the ground and look up. You're in a snake pit.