Proud -

Just remember understanding does not translate into caring.

An interesting thing I took from this article is they seem to only include the liberal base when talking about Obama supporters. The reason he was was, he won over independents like me. He has made some headway in recent months with independents, but I think if he goes back to liberal policies (like he did the first 2 years in office), he'll lose the independents again - and any chance of a second term.

How can anyone believe a word he says?

Ron,

yes he won the independents, like me. But I think the majority of us do not trust him any more. This independent will not be fooled again, no matter who the Republican candidate is, I will not vote Democrat this time around. He can only convince those who have not watched him over the past two years. Now that he has a "record", we can see his true colors, and they are not red, white, and blue.

A government cannot deliver benifits to the people that the people cannot deliver to themselves..

A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have.

Soon our foreign creditors will decide our money-printing amounts to a default, and they will stop buying our bonds on that day everyone how trusts you, everyone who belives in you will be wiped out..!!

JH-479998

How can anyone believe a word he says?

him or all presidents?

GuyLittle, very true.

Unfortunately, Obama has become way too much like his predecessors, especially the last one, and that is NOT what I voted for.

There really needs to be a viable third option this time around because I already know that, as usual, the GOP won't prop up a decent candidate.

Gendolkari; I don't believe any of these so called commander & chiefs have been in charge.. They are just front men for the few who are in control.. It is all SMOKE & MIRRORS..!! There is a reason they call it a dream.!!

Go to You Tube and search for "American Dream by the Provocateur Network"..

GuyLittle

A government cannot deliver benifits to the people that the people cannot deliver to themselves..

A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have.

Yes, the government decides to gets to keep the big chunk of the pie:

Median net worth of an Average American Family - $120,000

Median Net worth for members of Congress - $912,000

Between 2007-2009: Wall Street profits were up 720% while Americans’ Home Equity went down 35%

In 2009, an average CEO’s pay was 185 times bigger than that of his/her employee.

How much income have you given up for the top 1 percent?

Top 1% gained $673 billion in annual income while the bottom 20% lost $136 billion (that’s $5623 per household per year)

Despite a recession, massive layoffs and declining stock prices in 2001, the compensation of US executives at the biggest corporations surged ahead last year, with CEOs raking in billions in salaries, bonuses and stock options.

overall compensation for US executives increased 24 percent in 2001 to a median of $10.2 million.

What is missed here is that this is not just about Obama..it is about the whole 550 politicans we have foolishly allowed to do whatever with this country. We complain about Obama not standing up to the republicans..but really, no president has. Any item that goes to your congress , both parties , is full of holes for the wealthy and big business..like it or not..plus their own pet projects. Even today,,the republicans are calling for huige cuts to everything that has to do with the general public..cuting spending is fine as long as a rise in taxes occurs..otherwise..the only ones getting punished for the foolish spending of your elected in congress is the voters..while the wealthy get even more tax cuts.

him or all presidents?

Didn't Obama campaign on the promise that things would be "different and more transparent with him in office"? I guess that was part of the lie.

If voting could really change things, it would be illegal..!!

The FED is as much a federal branch of the government as federal express is..!!

SMOKE & MIRRORS..!! SLIGHT OF HAND.!!

The people of America must take our country back.!! We need leaders that are for America 1st..

Citizen K.

I'm not from San Francisco, and I think he's doing great. I'm neither stupid nor stubborn either.

In what respect is Obama doing great?

Foreign policy? Immigration issues? Lowering the cost of healthcare? Making medicare, medicaid and social security solvent for years to come? Lowering unemployment? Balancing the budget? Lowering energy costs and dependency? Making government transparent? Lowering the influence of lobbys? Growing the economy? Equalizing trade? Closing Gitmo? Getting us out of Iraq and Afganistan?

What has this president done besides repay his union supporters with hundreds of billions in taxpayer money and try and control what kids eat at lunch?

John-755418

him or all presidents?

Didn't Obama campaign on the promise that things would be "different and more transparent with him in office"? I guess that was part of the lie.

so again, him all or of them? We can't forget the "read my lips" speech or "WMD" speech.

Wake up2840

Just remember that half, 50%, of the population pays zero, nothing, nada, in taxes;

Pretty son the number will be even bigger become as the bottom 90% average household income goes down, the top 10% goes up. And since we don't make the 66% of corprorations pay taxes (don't forget that a corporation is considered a tax paying citizen with it's own "SS" number), the gap between what the revenue should be and what it actually is is getting larger.

You expect a family that makes 20K a year to shell out his/her share of taxes but you give a free pass to the 66% that also pay nada.

Bayllie - that's why I favor getting rid of tax loopholes across the board. Yes, it will hurt me because I'll lose all of those exemptions...but I'm fine with that if everyone else also loses their exemptions (individual and corporate). The funny thing is, the deficit commission said this, and so have Obama and Ryan...now the question is, can they put politics aside and implement this change? My guess is no, but we'll see what happens.

Wake up - everyone pays taxes. Some people don't pay federal income taxes, but we all pay sales tax, fees for various things, etc.

He will certainly under our frustration come voting time...

Ron-1861300

Bayllie - that's why I favor getting rid of tax loopholes across the board. Yes, it will hurt me because I'll lose all of those exemptions...

The purpose of these loopholes and deductions at some point was to promote growth of business. It was supposed to stimulate small businesses.

What became of it is these mega corporations swallowing smaller corporations to a point of almost monopoly. Try opening any kind of business today - you will be swallowed by the competition before you even know what hit you. This country is no longer pro business - it's pro selected few that have more money than God and who really control what is going on. All the loopholes are a legal way for corporation to manipulate numbers (read 28,000 page tax return) so that they can keep most of the profit without paying for the security of making that profit.

Today as, the taxpayers, we are asked to "sacrifice." The problem is that after I hear that these hedge fund managers report income in billions, my stomach turns because they are the same people that caused many if not most of us to loose our 401k and caused our homes to depreciate. While they cash their billion dollar paychecks, I have to deal with the fact that my house is worth 35% less today than it was when I bought it 5 years ago. Where is my bailout?

So I am p'd off about what is going on. I am pi$$ed when I hear right complain about SS like it's an ENTITLEMENT - it would be if I wasn't funding it for the past 20 years!

Ron, the point I am trying to make (even though it took me a while to get to it) is that we will end up loosing our deductions but I wouldn't hold my breath that the top 2% will.

They are like a spoiled child who got their way always so taking away that favorite toy (which is money) will be impossible.

skippytoad,

The CBO also published a graph that shows deficit spending. And right there is the spending of the Obama administration leading the pack. View it at the CBO site.

A Chevy Volt for every Obama vote!

slippytoad

Reversed the crash that Bush started? Uhmm...no. He put it into neutral by spending trillions on ARRA and TARP, but by no means has he reversed it....just put off the extension of the crash until he's out of office and inflation and interest kick in.

The unemployment trend just started getting better. No, I do not count taxpayer funded jobs at over $200,000 per temporary job (census, seasonal road construction, etc). Coincidence that the private sector finally started hiring after the 2010 elections???

Of course the international community likes him....you think this is a good thing? He's a pushover and European lapdog. I don't think Bush did a good job with this either....in fact, the last president that I felt was good with foreign policy and defending the United States was Reagan (who also wasn't the most popular president with the rest of the world).

So where is this list of what he's done? I've got my own list going here:

• got a Nobel Peace Prize for doing nothing
• presented a budget spending over $3 trillion dollars putting us 1.4 trillion further into debt
• spent almost a trillion dollars bailing out private companies (AIG, Goldman Sachs, General Motors, Bank of America, etc)
• spent hundreds of billions on no-bid ARRA contracts to create 223,000 temporary jobs
• sued a state he represents
• instructed the department of justice to not defend US law
• unconstitutionally initiated military use without congressional approval
• instructed congress to pass a law with less than 72 hours notice and did not allow time for debate

The only thing he has accomplished that is positive for the United States is repealing DADT.

Joe, nice post.

It's a shame that your logic will be lost on someone who has injested that much kool-aid.

what I am frustrated with is the whiners and complainers in the far far left of this country. Moaning and complaining is not going to help Obama push forward are 'big tent' agenda, and no one is going to get everything in two years. He is one man, and if the liberal complainers would have voted in 2010 we would not be in this situation where the fascist tea party a minority within an extreme minority have effective control of our nation.

Citizen K,

Don't sell yourself short, trust me...you're plenty of both

Bayllie - I agree with you on the difficulty of taxing the upper 2% and I'm not sure I have any good ideas except removing as many tax incentives as possible. As to corporate taxes...even if it's not perfect, if we can get rid of most of the exemptions and get businesses back to focusing on what's good for the core business, and not the best tax loopholes, that will be a good start. I've worked for small/med sized businesses and am currently trying to start a small one, and I know how hard it is.

"Obama told supporters on Thursday he is pressing ahead with his agenda"

As comments 1 & 1.1 pointed out... there is no understanding and no caring, only Obama's personal agenda.

Obama addressed about 200 people who paid up to $35,800 apiece for the fundraiser at a San Francisco hotel, the first of four fundraisers of the day.

Wait a minute! I thought Obama's supporters were the average working man or woman. Obama has done nothing but demonize the wealthy and yet, people are paying almost $36k a piece to see him speak. I don't know any average working man that can afford that! Oh wait, all the libs want to hide the fact that there are just as many wealthy Americans that donate to the Dems and want to dictate how to spend other people's money, just not theirs! Please, someone tell me the last time Sarah Palin charged $36k per person to speak!

"Obama addressed about 200 people who paid up to $35,800 apiece..."

Please help me out here folks. According to liberal Democrats, all rich people are evil Republicans. So were only Republicans at this fundraiser? Just doesn't make sense to me.

(Darn it STLMike...you beat me to the punch.)

It's especially hard to bring change when you really don't care.

Wait a minute! I thought Obama's supporters were the average working man or woman.

As an independent who voted for Obama, I totally agree.

He signed off on the dismantiling of jfcom, which caused about three thousand Americans to lose their job (link), and then afterwards, he goes on a "well needed vacation" as he put it.

Given that his response so far has pretty much been "Let them eat cake", I only hope the Republicans can pick a candidate worth voting for - I will protest vote against Trump, Palin, or any other clowns that make up the front running status Republicans have now.

Hs321 and STLMike....

There are only TWO types of Democrats....

1. Those who can afford to be.

2. Those who are too stupid to know otherwise.

"Obama said in an interview with the Associated Press on Friday (4/15/11) that fundimental questions about how to change Medicare and Medicaid or the tax system might have to wait until after the 2012 presidential election.

He (Obama) said he would have to offer spending cuts to win votes....." (Obama assesses GOP...MSNBC 4/16/11)

That is to say, I won't do it now, so I can promise it in the future in my campaign for reelection. What good are his promises anyway?

Ron-1861300

Good luck with the business because I know how hard it is and will be. I, too, have worked for a large corporation and now I work for a small one. I am for healthy business and I am against bullies and that's what today's Corporate America is becoming. The greed is overwhelming our stability and security. I hope we can start giving out deductions to those who deserve them: employers that provide decent health insurance, pay and benefits - employers that treat their employees as assets and not as liability. Give deductions to employers that create jobs in this country. Tax the crap out of those that make income here but have employers in China.

Wake up2840

Just remember that half, 50%, of the population pays zero, nothing, nada, in taxes; and most of those actually get money from the Government. 150,000,000 pay no taxes, but get money back. And the Presidents only plan is to tax the other 50% more!? This is the land of opportunity and freedom, but with freedom there is a cost; you are free to fail. We have taught more than one generation that living off the Government, which is the other half of the population, is your right. Can anyone with one rational thought grasp that concept and agree with it?

This is incorrect these 48 percent pay taxes they just overpaid and get a refund. Got to goggle real facts and from real sources not just listen to what you hear on FOX Cartoon News.

I'm an IND and voted for Obama and am disappointed with his approach to leadership....He is the President and not another DEM...My hope was that he would bridge the gap between both sides of the aisle, but all he's done is fuel his party...The signing of Healthcare Bill proved to me that he is for his party and his agenda only...No thru leader would support an obvious political power play to get their name on any landmark legislation, especially one that was not embraced by a LARGE number of Americans... I'm very disappointed. Another thing, I'm not a rich man, but know the rich are ones who hire...You cannot continue to vilify the rich simply because they are rich and we are not...that's ludicrous and frankly ignorant...The whole BS argument that those on the right are for the rich is bogus...Those on the left are just as rich, if not richer as well. They reap the benefit of what they claim is an attack upon the middle class....They are creating class warfare as well as partisan arguments between Americans whose only difference is the party they've registered to...This needs to stop...We need to hold all our representatives accountable and stop the political flava of the day attitude...our children's future depend upon it....

so again, him all or of them? We can't forget the "read my lips" speech or "WMD" speech.

So Obama is no better than the Bush's?

Joe,

• got a Nobel Peace Prize for doing nothing

that was decided by the Nobel Prize panel so unless your credentials trumps theirs, you are out of place to question them.

presented a budget spending over $3 trillion dollars putting us 1.4 trillion further into debt

so by presenting he outomatically put us into debt? doesn't it have to be approved by Congress first?

• spent almost a trillion dollars bailing out private companies (AIG, Goldman Sachs, General Motors, Bank of America, etc)

I don't know if you know that it was Bush and his administration who bailed out most of them.

instructed the department of justice to not defend US law

any examples of that?

unconstitutionally initiated military use without congressional approval

give an example and please don't use Libya.

instructed congress to pass a law with less than 72 hours notice and did not allow time for debate

where did you pull this one out of - your a$$?

with all this "evidence" you presented I must say the Republicans are either really stupid or really lazy because none of them have all this proof like you do. You should call them immediately.

Apparently coming up with honest answers for the American public was also a whole lot harder than expected.

First was the $700B...errr...make that $834B stimulus that was supposed to keep unemployment below 8%.

Then there was the fantasy of $500B dollars in savings that the Medicare actuaries roundly exposed as a lie. BTW, that is half the expected funding for the mandatory health insurance law...just disappeared.

Now it turns out his $4 trillion in debt reduction turns into a little more than half that (only $2.4T) when shown the light of day.

So much harder than expected, eh Mr. President?

Stand up Mr. President.!! Enforce executive order 11110.. Well all be on your side..!! Prove to us that you are here for AMERICA.!! Take our country back now.!!

Baylie, your responses are just lame. You only have to keep up with the news to know that what Joe said is absolutely true. Why should anyone have to supply you with links? Look it up yourself and you will be enlightened.

GuyLittle, you're not trying to get him killed now, are you?

Ron and Texana Deb, I want to ask this because I'm curious and I truly believe you are middle of the road independents. I hope you see this and respond truthfully.

On March 5th in the president's weekly address he was trying to play up the declining unemployment numbers. He said:

"But the progress we're seeing says something about the determination and ingenuity of our people and our businesses. What's also helping to fuel this economic growth are the tax cuts that Democrats and Republicans came together to pass in December and I signed into law – tax cuts that are already making Americans' paychecks bigger and allowing businesses to write off their investments, freeing more money for job creation."

How do you feel about that? Do independents give him credit for the tumbling unemployment rate? Or do you see that and find it disingenuous considering he's actually attributing the decline in unemployment to a couple conservative ideas that were blocked for two years by the left?

What a crock!!

"Change" has been harder than expected...

Harder for who? Him? The hardest thing for him and his wife is trying to find a place where they haven't already vacationed that has an airfield long enough to accomodate Air Force One. They need to see the Unemployment line from the ground instead of during a fly over photo op.

Notice how everything is projection into the future, after the elections, and 'you have to re-elect me to see the results.' The man has never stopped campaigning, that is what he does best. He's never met a camera or photo op he didn't like and he's been on television almost as much as Oprah. As a campaigning celebrity he gets an A+.

He's had two and a half years and he's still saying tomorrow. Then he keeps repeating the same story line, he's gonna focus like a lazer on education and infrastructure and what all else he's been going on about for the past 2.5 years. after awhile it all begins to run together, his lips move and repeat the same-o same-o. I guess I shouldn't complain, as long as he's campaigning he isn't getting us into deeper debt or another war.

The country still wants change Mr. Obama! In this case we want to see a change in the White House and Congress! Enough is enough!

No more liberal spending and smearing!

Mike in SA - I am an independent as well. I do not give Obama, the conservatives, or the liberals credit for increasing or declining unemployment. There is not much any government can do to control an economic cycle. After an economy tanks it takes a few years for it to rebound regardless of who is in office. The markets are usually the front runner of the economy rebound.

There are however a few things the governments (State and Fed both) are doing that impact the unemployment numbers.

1. The fact that there is a question on whether taxes will or will not be increased is weighing heavily on some small business owners. They would like to hire a couple extra people but are not sure they can afford to yet. They are waiting for clarity on what the tax policy will be before proceeding.
2. The teachers who have jobs now are concerned that they will not have jobs tomorrow. If I were a school teacher I would be concerned as well. The states have cut many school districts funding. Some school districts had their funding cut in half.

I will be watching both sides closely. I would like to see what both sides have to offer. I do not care for the mudslinging going on on either side today.

If you would be a great Senator, Representative, or President then please tell me why. If you tell me the other candidate is awful but then refuse to tell me why you are better then I have to assume you are not better but worse.

I think both sides need to go back to drawing board on budget cuts. There is plenty of waste in every department of the government. It should not cost $600 to buy a toilet. It should not cost $10 to buy a $.10 resistor. It should not cost the same amount of money to build a school as it does to build a skyscraper. There should not be tons of programs for the same thing each with its own set of forms to be filed in triplicate. When you start cutting budget this is the low lying fruit you go after first.

Please Repeal the Great American Mistake. We can not afford him any longer. That you congress for taking his CC away.

This group of Independents for the repeal of Obama, his health care mess.

This Group of Independents for the election of Tim Pawlenty. He will do as he states.

You repubs want to blame this on obama at least hes gonna try and do something about it your boy Dubya never did its price gouging and scams by the wall street commodities traders before oil was $147 a barrel gas was $4 today oil is less than $110 gas is $4 tell me difference has the price of refining oil into gasoline gone upby over a third in acouple of years or are the oilcompanies and the wall street commodities traders gouging us?

And caradjt elect pawlenty or any other repub and the price of any commodities will go thru the roof because wall street will run wild

And for those of you who dont understand $ 4 agallon gas is brought to you by the same hedge fund traders and brokers who brought you the recession but they found out that you still had a quarter to call the cops on and they came back for that

The faster me move on to electric cars that we need to only go the twenty to forty miles to work and back the better .Then we can save our gas car to go the 300 miles when we need it then we can tell the oil people to shove it.

This has got to be the most convenient Obama fiction yet. It is more of the same; pandering to his base's belief that all our problems are the fault of evil big corporations. There are three reasons gas prices are so high, and 2 1/2 of them we can do something about:

1) Unrest in the Middle East and North Africa causing oil prices to rise close to $115/barrel worldwide (a coherent policy might solve 1/2 of that)

2) Our falling American dollar (the fed)

3) Lack of drilling for our own resources. (that one should have been remedied years ago)

Oil is a world commodity, thats World, as in not just the U.S. It is ridiculous that the U.S. department of justice would be summoned to investigate. Who are they going to investigate, the Saudi royal family? Posing, can't stand it!!

bayllie

Joe,

• got a Nobel Peace

Yeah that post didn't work to well lol Ah well Ok Bayllie lets play your game :D

A Nobel Prize should be given to someone that has done something for the betterment of mankind. He got elected. They were kinda hoping that he would stop the wars. He chose not to. Heck even Al Gore did something showing where our consumption of fossil fuels were leading. Granted he is taking it a tad far now but he at least did something.

What was the Democrat controlled congress supposed to do? Say no to every pet project that they wanted to put money towards and he was saying it was ok?

Bush did do the first one. Obama did the second and third. I really hope you do some reading about things and not just listen to Rachel Maddow (who is just as bad as Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh).

Last I checked growing marijuana is illegal at the federal level. When he told the DEA to stop enforcing that law he basically stopped doing his job as the head of the Executive branch of the government. You know the branch that is supposed to enforce the law. Personally I think legalize and taxing it would be better then wasting manpower and money on it but that isn't the job of the president (or mine :D) to decide that is for congress to decide.

Libya is a great example but here is another one for you. He authorized the assassination of a radical Islamic cleric that is a US citizen. Basically saying even though you were born here and are still a citizen here you have no rights. Kinda scary isn't it.

72 hours 72 hours hmmm Wasn't there a certain HEALTHCARE BILL that was passed in 72 hours.

Oh and just so you know I am no Democrat or Republican. I would actually say I am more Libertarian in outlook because the Dems and Repubs stick their noses into things that aren't their business WAY TO MUCH.

Obama, lacks the balls to tell the Amer. people that there is no evidence that the rising cost of gasoline is the result of price gouging, fraud or manipulation by the gas companies and is instead the result of ME unrest and the international market. Holder, who surely has vastly more knowledge of the subject than Obama, appears to strongly support that position and seems to feel that a formal investigation is wholly unnecessary. Nevertheless, Obama seems to have ordered Holder to conduct one causing Holder to form the Financial Fraud Enforcement Working Committee (I wonder how much the PR firm got paid to think up that name) to perform what Holder seems to believe to be a totally unnecessary investigation at taxpayer expense. Why is Obama doing this? To get votes at taxpayer expense. Will we ever hear back, if at all, from the FFEWC before the 2012 election? FAT CHANCE!!!

Randy, news flash!!

Electricity is prodoced by burning fossil fuels in this country. Solve that, and then talk about Electric cars sticking it to the oil companys.

US oil refineries are now operating at 81% capacity. The Saudis complained the other week that there is a glut of oil. They are running out of storage space.

The commodity speculators are running up the price. Now there are commodity markets all over the World and most have speculators. So just as the DeBeers family releases diamonds from it's vaults very slowly to keep prices up the speculators release crude onto the market slowly to keep the price up.

Obama's committees will do nothing what they need to do is to pass a law that anyone who bids on oil contracts has to be the person that takes delivery and then speculators can't sell the contracts later at a higher price.

This is what also drives up the price of corn, copper, cotton and all other commodities.

What a bunch of BS, as usual. And the gas prices???? He knows damn well that the intentional devaluing of the US dollar is a major cause in our increasing gas prices!!! Liar Liar Daddy O, come 2012 YOU GOTTA GO! And take Mama O with you.

And leave the fast food chains alone michelle, I LIKE SWEET TEA.

More government intrusion, banning sweet tea. WTF!!

God the Repubs need to get someone worth voting for.

As Trump said today, "Obama is a disaster on every front!" If anything, maybe the straight talk, non-PC Trump will make some of the suits on the Republican side realize that we don't want to her you say you feel Obama is "misguided". No political soft shoe crap!! We want you to say it like it is and mean it . . . Obama is the worst President in our great Country's history and it is time to take our Country back before the Socialist, spread the wealth, community organizer completely destroys us!

He is just horrendous in everything he does, or doesn't do. He is so in over his head. Fool us once and shame on you, Fool us twice and shame on me!

Ron 1861300:

What don't you get? This man is a Liberal/Progressive/Socialist to the core! It is his very being. He's just a screwed now with a Republican House. And they better shut him down on the debt ceiling. I want to see Obama joke on that - let the defaults begin!

Texana Deb:

You are right! Obama doesn't know, comprehend or respect what the red, white and blue stands for!

Too bad. The President should have called the N.Y. Mercantile and asked them to raise margins to get some of the non-industry speculators out of the market. If that failed he should have signed an Executive order limiting the amount of non-industry speculation.

Instead he's adding more Govco., something he and "W" have excelled at (Dept. of Homeland Security,TSA, Consumer Czar, Great Czar's Ghost).

I use to be a Republican but recently they have embarrassed themselves to no end. They lie and sin worse that Democrats yet try to pass themselves off as the moral party. GOP stands for the Gas & Oil Party.

Of course the price is high because the oil companies are raising the price to gouge the American people. Oil was around $150 dollars a barrel while Bush was in office and the gasoline price was around $4 a gallon nationally. Now anyone that isn't an idiot can see that with the price of oil around $110-$112 dollars that the $2.90 price they are charging for gasoline now is not far from the price when oil was about $30-$35 higher per barrel. Oil companies are ripping off the American people and they should have to pay a windfall tax.

Obama and his merry men are the embarrassment. You might want to take a look at his to-do-list and see that the check off boxes are empty. With a partial completion on health-care, which we will reverse.

He's also now owns his own WAR! Now we get to call him the war monger. And his indecisevness led to a lot of people being slaughtered.

And oil is high because Odumbo won't allow us to do what we should be doing in our own country - drilling! Instead, this spread-the-wealth Socialist is giving money to Brazil and others to drill and telling them we will buy the oil from them. I sure has made Americans the pathetic laughing stock of the world.

That's okay, we now have the House, and November 2012 we will have all three house!

i can grantee u will not see a republican trying to do this!

And gas wouldn't be at $4.00, quickly heading to $5.00, a gallon.

and do u know that bp profits have actually gone up even with the exploded rig? its hard to believe but its true! google it!

I wonder if it will be the same task force Bush used a few years ago, and I wonder if it will be the same report Bush published. No wrong doing, again.

Barry is using this to divert attention from Libya, as he must think the American public is so easily dazzeled that we don't notice he's campaigning, as usual.

Is this guy serious? He want's to stop those businesses who take advantage of us with high gas prices, well, IT'S THE WHOLE F....NG WALL STREET, go get them boy, they are your friends.

I also wan't to apologize the fact that I voted for him, NO F....NG MORE.

supersmooth:

Well of course their profits have gone up. Since Obama won't let us drill in our own country, we are totally reliant on the whacked-out middle-east and others, instead of taking care of ourselves. So, supply and demand. They have it, we want it. Oils going up, profits are going up. That's the way it works.

I'm an educated man and it continues to astound me how many stupid people there are in this country.

To think most of the people in this room can pass through what Bush left Obama and point the finger with a straight face... We were on the brink.

What a bunch of ingrates and minions.

What amazes me is that we have done so well in the past 2 years with so many fools obstructing progress at every step.

Give me the past, they say!

Give me more of what Bush gave us ------ LOL! Talk about the definition of insanity...

A Task Force to investigate Gas Prices.

How come the President doesn't know why Petroleum is so costly?. Is he that inexperienced to know that answer himself?

Now how long will this take (like most of his decisions)--5 more years; 2 terms, and 10.00 per gallon gas?

His ways of Leadership are astoundlngly lame. He just doesn't get how to be a President of the US, and start using our own resources to at least begin to get moving on relying on ourselves.

This is going to take many years, since he wants all kinds of permits before drilling--

Well, most people won't be able to drive or commute to work, since gasoline prices will take up much of their income--no jobs again. Task forces for this and task forces for that---nothing gets done--it is a stall tactic for no answer and no action.

Forget the Electric Cars. That also takes so much money for anyone who drives, it is not fiscally feasible. It costs over $2,000.00 to just get started getting the batteries set up in your own garage. Every thirty miles, the electric car has to be charged. That also means no more than 30 miles to work.

How ridiculous. The thinking is off the wall, and so is his solution.

At least he is doing something about the price of gas, unlike BUSH, who had ass raped the entire country for eight years and lovin every minute of it.

"We are going to make sure that no one is taking advantage of the American people for their own short-term gain," Obama said at a town-hall style meeting at a renewable energy plant in Reno, Nev.

Ironic since he is on the top of the list!

Wasn’t BP one of his top contributors?

He better do something to get his 52% disapproval rating up

http://newsfeed.time.com/2010/08/24/new-poll-barack-obamas-disapproval-rating-reaches-highest-peak/

Price of Gas

On Jan.20,2009....The Glorious Day of the Obama Inaugu-Coronation gas was at $1.82......It is now at $3.83....A year ago it was $2.97.....

Yes, PHAT P. ....Please tell us all what Obama has done about rising gas prices....they been going up since the day he was Beatified....

I'll tell you....he is driving the value of the Dollar down and it costs more dollars to buy anything...gas, bread, coffee.....Oil is traded on the World market in U.S. Dollars and with a devalued dollar it costs more of them to buy the same barrel of oil....Tim Geithner and the FED are doing this.

Obama wants to make oil, coal and natural gas so expensive that it will come close to what it costs for his dopey green energy alternatives.

Hey Fed...GMTA !!...The countdown clock is ticking.....

Morning Mike! tick tock tick tock...

If Mr. Obama is sincere about having a task force SERIOUSLY look into gas prices - That 'Task Force' should start with a clean sweep of the E.P.A. and uncover the vast outside influences imposed upon that particular department. It is extremely doubtful that OPEC has not had a vigorous part in shaping the agenda coming out of the E.P.A.. The Environmental Protection Agency has, quite literally, hog-tied the United States and forced every administration to trade with foriegn sources for decades. In the meantime, this nation has seen very little advancement in building new refineries right here in the US and hampered any efforts in developing our own natural resources.

Eric Holder's on the case? Whew...that's a load off.

I'll look into it. Same speech over and over. That can mean anything you want. Fuel prices started the downward spiral before, and any type of recovery is far away with the renewed price spike.

Obama is all talk!

Someone point out what the Obamaism era has accomplished!

One more war for the US, higher taxes, record debt, record foreclosures, higher that state unemployment combined with, no jobs, a crooked government that bailed out Wall Street and the Bankers, phoney unkept campaign promises, - if Obamas lips are moving, one knows he is lying!

Mr. President,

I did not vote for you but you are my president too. Let me give you some advice. Your advisors/handlers/iealogues are making you look plain foolish. If you would like to lower the price of oil there are three things you can do:

1. Open ANWR for drilling immediately. Speculators will be forced to rethink their strategies.
2. Drill everywhere in the US that you can. Sends the message to OPEC and the oil markets even further.
3. Release some national strategic oil reserves.
4. Shut up about class warfare for 5 minutes, will ya?

I know that was four things, but the last one was just some bonus advice.

Notice I did not say anything about windturbines and solar fields. Not the answer on a wholesale basis Mr. Prez.

BobB.

A Nobel Prize should be given to someone that has done something for the betterment of mankind.

Again, since you have better credentials than the Nobel Prize panel, you should bring that up with them because they are the ones that decided. This is not any different than people voting and electing a president YOU DID NOT VOTE FOR. Should he not have become a president just because you disagree with the outcome?

Bush did do the first one. Obama did the second and third. I really hope you do some reading about things and not just listen to Rachel Maddow (who is just as bad as Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh).

Again, Joe claimed Obama awarded ALL OF IT. Understand what you read. Did Obama spend almost trillion dollars on the companies that Joe named? Or did Bush bail out banks? By the way, I don't watch any of the people you listed.

Last I checked growing marijuana is illegal at the federal level. When he told the DEA to stop enforcing that law he basically stopped doing his job as the head of the Executive branch of the government. You know the branch that is supposed to enforce the law.

The Obama Administration would not seek to arrest medical marijuana users and suppliers as long as they conform to state laws. Your are implying that he would not enforce ANY use of marijuana so your post is a lie because it conveninetly omits some facts that don’t fit into your agenda. Sure, going after the cancer patients should be your top priority.

Libya is a great example but here is another one for you.

We are not at war with Libya.

He authorized the assassination of a radical Islamic cleric that is a US citizen. Basically saying even though you were born here and are still a citizen here you have no rights. Kinda scary isn't it.

You mean the No. 1 terrorist in terms of threat against us? Good for him. I hope he gets the bastard.

72 hours 72 hours hmmm Wasn't there a certain HEALTHCARE BILL that was passed in 72 hours.

The pattern over the last several years has been to bring bills up with no notice in the middle of the night, so given that, I'll settle for an ironclad 72 hours. At average rates, a person could conquer the bill in seven to 13 hours. Each Congressman has an army of staff members as well. Anyways, if you don’t like how the Congress has been going about their business, bring it up with them because this case is not something extraordinary. Also, wasn’t the bill debated for over a year? Don’t the Republicans claim that they contributed to it as well?

Oh and just so you know I am no Democrat or Republican. I would actually say I am more Libertarian in outlook because the Dems and Repubs stick their noses into things that aren't their business WAY TO MUCH.

But you are into the government sticking their nose into cancer victims' smoking their perscription marijuana?

Mike in Delray

Price of Gas

On Jan.20,2009....The Glorious Day of the Obama Inaugu-Coronation gas was at $1.82......It is now at $3.83....A year ago it was $2.97.....

The Wall Street controls the price of gas - not the President. Our US government isn’t responsible for putting price tags on the gas pumps. Stop spreading lies.

If we go with your theory, how do you explain that 1 gal. of gas in 2000 was $1.56 but in July of 2008 it ranged from a "low" $3.86 to a high of $4.30?

Mike in SA,

Thanks for the question...that's a difficult one for me, especially since I tend to focus on the long-term impact and not worry too much about what's going to happen in the next 12 months (I care about the impact on individuals, but I think there is enough of a safety net here to keep people from being hungry or homeless).

Having said that, I think there are 2 main reasons for the recent unemployment changes.

First, I think the policies from the Democratic leaders (Pelosi, Reid and Obama) during those first 2 years scared a lot of businesses. They were scared about excessive regulation, unsustainable deficit levels that would eventually result in increased tax burdens, and they were not sure what other changes were coming. This resulted in businesses putting off hires and expansion plans they otherwise would have implemented at the end of a normal recession. (i.e.; we didn't get the hiring we normally see at the end of a recession)

Second, although businesses may not agree with everything the Republicans were saying, they liked having a divided government because it prevents extreme changes from being implemented.

I think keeping the tax rates in place helped a little, but I don't think it would have changed things much if they had expired for the upper 2%. The upper 2% change may have affected the long-term picture, but I don't see that having much short-term impact.

I think the main reason for the short term unemployment changes is businesses are no longer scared that extreme changes will be implemented. This allows them to get back to long-term planning, which means hiring to replenish their labor pools (which they intentionally cut more than needed since they were not certain where things were going).

PS: this was before coffee, so my apologies if it's not that coherent :-)

Frankly I do not believe these folks who are stating that they were independents and voted for Obama, but now will vote republican because he did healthcare reform and do not want to cut Social Security or Medicare or because he does not compromise enough.

If these pretenders were indeed independents who voted for the president they would Not have been happy.

Because to most progressives, liberals and moderate conservatives, he compromised too much giving in to the machinations of these republicanconservativeteabaggers too often, resulting in the continuation of the Bush tax cuts for the top 10% and the lack of a public healthcare option, no cap on pharma and his looking a bit wishywashy on protecting the public safety nets.

These pretenders need to realize that not everyone is gullible and will be taken in by their so-called disappointment and now their willingness to so readily vote republicanconservativeteabagger in the next election because the president compromised and gave them all they wanted, even as they criticize the president for giving them all they wanted.

"Obama says new task force will examine gas prices"

Another chance to fool people into thinking he's doing something. Here's what you need to know;

There are 42 gallons in a barrel of oil. When the price of oil goes up from $100 per barrel to $120 (20%), the basic material cost of the gasoline should increase from about $2.38 per gallon to about $2.86 per gallon ($0.48). The rest of the cost for gasoline is for transport, refining, distribution, taxes and profit, and are relatively stable.

If there is a significant discrepancy with this formula, then there is probably some 'speculation' going on somewhere - probably by Wall Street.

Interesting sidelight - Only about half of our imported oil goes towards making gasoline and diesel fuel. The rest goes towards making other products, like plastics, fertilizers, lubrications, cleaning agents, etc.

BZe1,

Different people have different perspectives and different priorities. I have no loyalty to either party - my loyalty is to whatever I think is best for the country as a whole. As an example, all things being equal, I'll vote for the candidate that promises to bring the least money to my district because I think this cycle of voter greed is a huge problem in this country.

I voted for the Democrats from 2002 to 2008 because I strongly disagreed with Iraq, the general military buildup, the Patriot Act, the marriage act (forget the name), stem cells, the prescription drug bill, and the Bush tax cuts (all of them - not just the top 2% change).

I voted for Obama because I thought he would bring true bipartisanship to Washington, and I thought he cared about the deficit. His actions have not been close to meeting my expectations on either of these issues.

I believe government can be effective at moderating corporate greed, but I do not believe government is very efficient at actually running things. Therefore, I was against a public option - and I was very disappointed they didn't address the cost issue by doing things such as allowing interstate competition and including tort reform.

In the end, I've come to the conclusion Obama is just another politician. He's better at giving speeches than most, but I was hoping for a statesman that was more concerned with country than party.

bayllie..(#1.98)...You said "Stop spreading lies."

Lies my eye,........ those are just facts....I made my reply to PHAT P. who claimed "At least he [Obama]is doing something about the price of gas, unlike BUSH, who had ass raped the entire country for eight years and lovin every minute of it."

I'll not disagree with you that gas prices were going up in 2008 as the world spiraled into economic meltdown, but I will also point out that the price went from $3.63 in Sept.2008 to $1.68 on Jan. 5, 2009 and have been climbing ever since.

It was that same spike in gas prices that caused there to be No COLA's for Social Security,etc.... September is when the SS administration does there calculations.

The President's Domestic Oil policies, the FED screwing with the value of the Dollar, world supply and demand, turmoil in OPEC nations, futures market betting on the price of oil months from now...contribute to what is going on.

But, nowhere did I post a lie.

Mike,

But, nowhere did I post a lie.

You claim Obama is responsible for the gas price hike and that is a lie. The government's role in the price is limited to the tax they add to it so unles Obama is rasing taxes each day, he is not responsible for the price of it. What is your solution? You want the government to regulate the price of gas?

The President's Domestic Oil policies, the FED screwing with the value of the Dollar,

we should regulate Wall Street then to -or take the power away from them because it's the Wall Street that dictates the prices.

Flat tax or fair tax or at least a complete redo of the progressive 5000000 page crap we have now. The tax code is the biggest problem we have. the govt should not be allowed to manipulate it to give bonuses for kickbacks --buying votes--- PERIOD! Taxes should be one page long and take ten minutes.

So...tax reform big time

TERM LIMITS!

Abolish the FED

After all if our DOLLAR was not falling off the cliff gas prices would not be rising ....instead of going after gas companies he should go after who started this mess...........NYC wall street ripoff artist who are still trying to count the money they stole (barnet frank and franklin raines ripped off fanni mae and mac)and then obama instead putting them in jail; he bails them out and has the fed give them bonuses to help fix the very criminal mess they created ....they profit both ways.......the fed inflates the dollar and we lose 20% of our savings and it hasnt even got started good yet..........the worst is yet to come and they keep making it worse trying to put it off till after they are reelected----@!$%#S!

they know what i am saying is correct and they know 85% of americans dont understand it.....so there he is lying his ass off on tv day in and day out and the liberal media HELPS HIM GET AWAY WITH IT----they ignore any wrong he does---it is mind boggling how they avoid doing ANY CRITICAL REPORTING ON obama---they protect him at all costs---it is amazing ?

It's all owned by Goldman Sachs. Oil speculation is out of control. If a muslim farts, gas goes to 52 week highs. Until we have a president that appoints financial managers and economists that aren't Sachs cronies, we'll have bubble, after bubble, after bubble. And the largest corporation will have tax loophole, after tax loophole, after tax loophole. until we have politictians on the right and left that aren't coporate shills, it won't matter who is president the middle class will be screwed. Welcome to democaracy run by the corporate world.

john-3308023,
I agree with you 100% - I have exactly the same complaint.

bayllie...(#1.104) "You claim Obama is responsible for the gas price hike and that is a lie."

I made no such claim. Try to understand what I really said. Again, I told PHAT P. That Obama was doing nothing to bring the price of gas down. And I pointed out that there are many factors involved in the price of oil. The policies of our Government are some of those factors and I pointed out some of them.

Obama in his own words said his polices would "necessarily cause utility rates to skyrocket" (speaking of his Cap & Trade ideas)....to raise money for the Green Energy projects that private industry has no desire to pursue because they are not cost effective. Jeff Immelt of GE is waiting in the West Wing for any and all Government handouts for "alternative energy" funding.

Oil is just one commodity seeing record highs...look at cotton, gold, silver, soybeans, coffee....all up. It costs more Dollars to buy them because the Dollar is worth less is one reason.

I believe that Obama thinks high energy prices are good because they cause people to use less, therefore lessening the U.S. Carbon Footprint....and that he isn't doing any of the things he could to ease energy costs.....and his announcement of the Task Force is purely a political ploy, to make it appear he is doing something....18 months to election day and he is in full campaign mode and he doesn't even have an opponent yet. He is campaigning to rewrite his own record, now that he has one.

Still ...no lies on my part.

Mike,

Obama in his own words said his polices would "necessarily cause utility rates to skyrocket" (speaking of his Cap & Trade ideas

you are implying then that the only policies that out government should make are the "gas price" friendly ones. There is a reason why the Republicans are considered Big Oil friendly and the Democrats are not.

Obama wants to make oil, coal and natural gas so expensive that it will come close to what it costs for his dopey green energy alternatives.

The prices have been going up with some exceptions of going down shortly just to go up again. We need to move away from the dependence on oil (especially foreign) today because tomorrow might be too late.

Try to understand what I really said.

I am simply trying to point out that you cannot put 100% of the blame on Obama. There are too many factors.

I don't know about the rest of the country, but in the Seattle area the price of gas progressively decreased during the Gulf spill. How does that make sense?

bayllie..(#1.109)...."I am simply trying to point out that you cannot put 100% of the blame on Obama"

You don't have to simply try to point out anything...Especially about something I never said. Stop trying to "read between the lines" of what others post and twist their meanings.

Have a nice day....

Hey Mike,

Bayllie is one of those lying liberals...dont waste your time!

BZe1 - Believe what you want about who are and are not independents.

Unfortunately as an independent I do not have anyone representing me from either Democrats or Republicans. As an independent I voted for Obama in 2008 because:

• he was going to bring the deficit under control
• because he was going to end the patriot act
• because of the on going wars that we could not afford
• because I was concerned about the Republican candidates.
• I was OK with his proposed tax policies because we needed to bring the deficit under control.
• Because although I disagreed National Health Care, Obama's plan made more sense than Hilary's.

Once Obama got into office the Democrats took my vote to mean that I liked Hilary's Health Plan. Passing Hilary's Health plan was more important than the deficit and debt, getting us out of wars, fixing the patriot act, or helping to create new jobs during a bad economy. Extra tax money was added to pay for Hilary's Health Plan. On top of that extra spending on other government projects was added which increased the deficit and debt.

At this point the Democrats have a credibility issue. The Democrats could make enormous strides in the next year if they actually go after spending. Until they start to cut spending I have a hard time believing that extra taxes will actually go towards paying down debt and not towards another purpose.

Democrats can either wear blindfolds and decide that the independents posting are not true independents, or they can listen to the independents and actually make a course correction.

Phat:

You ain't seen nothing yet, before this term is over--Bush was a cowboy, compared to this spendaholic, and not interested in the welfare of his people. Talk is cheap. Action speaks louder than words. It sure is quiet.

There is no action. Why does the CNN Poll put "O" at a 70 per cent disapproval rate from the poll they took. Something is wrong, and it isn't Bush who has not been in office for almost 3 years.

Are you personally related to Pres. Obama? Only his relatives and cronies will now support him in his "no" decisions on every subject that is put on his Oval Office Desk.

Sure this will be Collapsed. The Media is so enmeshed with this man's persona, they can't see the Forest from the Trees. He has done nothing to improve the World nor his own Country..

Now he has the challenge of working on Petroleum costs for all Americans.

It's pathetic that some people continue to blame Bush for all these problems...Give me an f'ing break...The president has been in office for over 2 years already...Time to drop the excuses...

when it comes to debt, we'll stop talking about Bush when we're finished paying for his disastrous mistakes.....it's gonna be awhile

when it comes to debt, we'll stop talking about Bush when we're finished paying for his disastrous mistakes.....it's gonna be awhile "

agreed !

If Billy blow job , had taken Bin Laden , instead of 21 year old "Bush"

KING OBIMBO , wouldn't be killing Pakistanis ....today !

Frankly speaking the debt has been an accumulation of every administration for at least 20 years. The problem with the debt is that the interest on the debt keeps rising and it will start to go exponential soon if we don't change things. Stop bickering about who's fault it is and work towards fixing it. I am sure there are a number of things that the government could do now that would curb spending without a major impact to many people. Go after these things first since they have least impact on everyone.

takingmiddleground....That's the problem, it's easier to point the finger of blame than to address the issue head on...People who follow this approach are nothing more than lazy cowards...

"lazy cowards "

Thats what i said

a draft dodging Rapist ........................Clinton

R L kraft...I never voted for Clinton, but pointing the finger of blame at him without having a solution to address the problem is lazy and cowardly...I voted for Bush and Obama...surprising for some people to understand..however, it's not the President who is to blame, it's Congress...pointing the finger of blame at any President is complete BS...I'm disappointed with Obama because he did not follow the will of the American people, only his party...This country will continue to be screwed until we clean house of all incumbents and replace them with freshman congresspeople who understand what is needed in this country and work to make that change....In the meantime, everything is just talk...and talk is extremely cheap in this country.

RL kraft # 1.120 -

a draft dodging Rapist ........................Clinton

draft dodging - That could be said about anyone that chose school over service.

Rapist - That's one I've never heard before, could you please elaborate? Who was it that Clinton raped?

I was never a fan of Clinton, but in his defense I have to say that your Rapist remark is preposterous, unless you know something the rest of the country doesn't.

ctdad - here are some of my thoughts on cutting. I do not think there is a silver bullet that will fix budget. There is alot of cumulative waste though.

Defense:

• If military does not want a product do not force them and tax payers to purchase.
• Consolidate purchasing of equipment and negotiate bulk rates

Contracts in general

• Prefer off the shelf stuff before special ordering.

Money to states

• Replace use it or loose it budgeting with apply for money based on next years needs.

Medical Costs:

• Sit AMA, ABA, and insurance CEOs in room. Give them an opportunity to work together on a plan to reduce medical costs in US by X%. If they can not agree to a plan pass legislation that dictates max charge for each medical procedure, each lawsuit, and each insurance premium.

Programs

• Consolidate redundant programs.

This is just a start.

takingmiddleground...good points...but here's some suggestions from my side.

1. Provide huge tax breaks for corporations to hire qualified US citizens.

2. Pull tax breaks from corporations outsourcing overseas.

3. Institute a national luxury tax on purchases over 25K

4. Allow citizens to write off interest on credit cards.

ctdad - Sorry I generally do not like tax specialization period. This is the fiscal conservative side of me. I especially do not like lowering the effective average tax rate any more then they already are when debt is out of control.

Instead

• Remove all credits, deductions, exemptions, and special treatment of income.
• Reduce tax rates to compensate and make it equivalent to average tax rate. (except for top .1% they get move to average tax rate of 25% instead of 21%)
• Lower corporate tax rate to 25% and remove corporate loop holes.

Most people continue to pay same total taxes. Those using various scheme to avoid tax will not be able to so they will pay more. Those who did not qualify for any deductions before get lower tax. Everyone pays their fair share. Also, we can spend less tax payer money on court cases proving tax fraud, because the tax code is more clean cut.

Right on.

If the guy would actually agree to spend LESS than we receive

But isn't that the argument, raising revenue in conjunction with reforming spending? The GOP simply wants to cut all entitlement spending AND reduce revenue by lowering tax rates while the DEMS want to maintain a social safety net, which a huge majority of Americans agree with regardless of how many times Cantor, Walker, Ryan or Boehner get up on stage and misrepresent the will of the American people. An honest conversation includes spending reform as well as tax increases.

Well for starters - If we could get the 40 or 50 million Americans to Pay some Federal Tax that would help. Then if you got 40 or 50 million Back to work that would be more Federal Income Tax coming Back into the system. Then we use all of this to Pay Down the Debt. NO MORE SPENDING!!!!

The thing that bothers me is that - when more money starts to come in - the Democrats are just going to want to spend it. I don't trust that the money would go to paying down the Debt.

Absolutely! When democrats and old guard republicans see $1 coming in, they rush out and spend $1.50. We need to gut spending FIRST. ONLY THEN should we entertain "revenue enhancers", or the new income will just be spirited away, business as usual.

How can he rage class warfare with a straight face? His speech the other day he said to students that he didn't want to see homeless while driving down the road. Mr prez, your lack of economic skills have made the homeless ranks swell the last two years. Isn't your brother homeless in Kenya? You made 1.7 million last year, but can't afford to help your own brother? How do we expect you to take care of a country when you can't even take care of your own family. Also our esteemed prez that rebuked the Bush tax rates and now says he will not let them remain when they expire, used them to pay his own taxes. Hey odumbo, you are 7 times over rich since you define rich as $250,000. Sounds like you are one of those greedy rich people!!!!

Yep - He HAS to Re-Distribute the Wealth!!!! Oh but it better not come from his own money.

chas-2406313, You are right in that the Class warfare is being waged, but you are wrong on by whom and on whom. Class warfare is systematically being waged for the past 30 years by the rich and the powerful bankers on the middle class people who do not have a voice in the government.

Rich and powerful have essentially bought over Paul Ryan, John Boehner, Sen. McConnell, Ensign, Vitter, and all the republican folks. I encourage you to see the video that came out yesterday, in which Paul Ryan was being booed by Conservative libertarians in a town hall meeting, where he refused to answer why he wants to lower the taxes on the rich millionaires and billionaires. Even some of the tea party folks, who are the henchmen for Charlie Koch have woken up and starting asking questions why the Class warfare.

Asking the privileged, rich and wealthy who have immensely benefited from the favorable tax codes and their relationship with the power-brokers, to pay more is NOT Class warfare. If the middle class in this country becomes extinct as dinosaurs, then the rich will have to start building a new Mayflower ship to perhaps China.

Lowering the tax rate is "spending". When companies like GE rake in record profits and get rebates instead of paying in the argument to just cut spending is hollow. Shared sacrifice is what is called for, tax increase as well as spending reform. Anyone who argues against shared sacrifice does nothing more than show their ignorance of the issue and the current imbalances in the system.

drano

You say that Republicans want to cut ALL entitlement spending? Please show me the quote from a Republican that wants to cut ALL entitlement spending. I bet you won't find anyone on the right saying that. The only people who say that are the fools who believe the trash that comes out of the left. SOME entitlement spending MUST be cut. And I say, let ALL of the Bush/Obama tax cuts expire. If they all expire we can add close to 4 trillion dollars to the coffers in ten years. If only the "rich" cuts expire we add only 600 billion in ten years. The liberals spend 600 billion in a few days so it won't help. We all need to contribute, even our President who only pays around 27% in taxes on 1.7 million.

The GOP is big into "cuts". If you're elderly and/or disabled, you get a cut in your Medicare/Medicaid. If you're rich or a mega-corporation, you get a cut in your taxes.

Isn't really going to matter what is cut or not..., if America goes bankrupt...

JH,

What you don't see in the Ryan budget is any cuts to the oil company "entitlements".

Or rich people "entitlements". Ryan's plan extends the Bush tax cuts and cuts the corporate tax rates from 35% to 25%.

Then he wants to cut the budgets of Medicaid, Pell grants, food stamps and low income housing. Programs that account for only 21% of the federal budget but being used to make 66% of the cuts.

The fact that President Obama paid 27% in taxes shows that he is more considerate than most at his income level that pay 17% as an average effective tax rate.

It would be easy to pay for entitlements if companies like GE and Exxon actually paid taxes. They each made tens of billions of dollars in profits and didn't pay a penny in taxes.

Butterfly Mage

It would be easy to pay for entitlements if companies like GE and Exxon actually paid taxes. They each made tens of billions of dollars in profits and didn't pay a penny in taxes.

Your request is very unfair. How can you ask a company that had a net profit of $10 billion a year to pay taxes? That is a sole responsibility of a Middle Class Family!

@JH

First we can agree on your statement to let all of the Bush tax cuts expire. I think that if you research the subject a bit more you'll find that the 27% that the Obama's paid on 1.7 million is actually higher that what most people with incomes of 1.7 million paid, which is part of the problem. The point I was making earlier, and stand by, is that the republicans are one dimensional, all they feel is needed is to cut spending and FURTHER reduce taxes, which seems to be in conflict with even your suggestion. As vwterry pointed out, when will the republicans start cutting corporate entitlements and corporate welfare? Furthermore, if you want to start hurling stones about spending, start with Reagan and Bush, both grew the government beyond what was necessary, Reagan simply "spent" the Soviet Union into the ground, which we've been paying for ever since, and Curious George, that moron not only started a war without just cause and based on lies, he refused to consider it in his budget, instead kicking it down the road for the next president, and passed bills in the middle of the night (Medicare Part D) when no one was looking or could protest. If you want to have an honest conversation, let's have at it, if you simply want to spew nonsense, keep it to yourself and quit wasting everyone's time.

vw - "The fact that President Obama paid 27% in taxes shows that he is more considerate than most at his income level that pay 17% as an average effective tax rate."

Or maybe he is just less financially competent... perhaps trying to spend his way to prosperity?

vwterry - Ryan's plan does call for eliminating tax loopholes such as the oil company "entitlements". He uses the term "tax expenditures", but that's what he's referring to. See page 51 in his doc for details. By the way, Obama and the deficit commission also call for eliminating these loopholes. I'm not holding my breath on it though...:-)

Also, please don't take my comment as a blanket endorsement of Ryan's plan. There are parts I like and parts I dislike. Overall, I prefer the deficit committee recommendations.

Good comeback guys. So, I still await hearing about the "Plan". We still don't have a plan from the Republican Party as of yet. We have a coupon deal, voucher deal, chit deal on healthcare suggestion but that's not really a plan. Outside of that, I'm not sure how the Republican Party is trying to win my vote. I need more than the every popular Birth question followed by "I hate Obama, I hate Obama" vote for me. That's not a plan either. That's a waste of time. So, as recall hearing; jobs jobs jobs what I've got is Mr. Walker/Koch, S & H Green Stamp Healthcare proposal and lots of deficit rhetoric. That's not an attractive proposition. Oh sorry, I've Apprentice President on offer it seems.

Skip: The GOP has a plan, of course. They want to cut all entitlement programs, pensions, and low-end government jobs and use the budgetary savings to allow corporations to pay zero taxes and to allow the wealthiest 1% to have the lowest tax rate in American history. They'll re-criminalize homosexuality while they're at it and make Christianity the Federal Religion.

I tend to vote Republican and I have a problem Mage. I really do not care in the least what homsexuals do in the privacy of their own homes. I also could care less what religion you practice as long as you do not interfere with my life. And if you want to abort another welfare baby,more power to you.

"House Republicans have passed a plan that would reduce the deficit by nearly $6 trillion in a decade"

Where in this article is the part about where he wants to give the savings resulting from the spending cuts away to the wealthy and the corporations? Whey do the articles never mention that part of the "plan"?

DMAC,

Your comments add nothing to an adult conversation. Calling out names with nothing to add as to why you think that is just bitching. If all you want to do is blather out loud your anger, why not go to the right wing radio shows where there are others unable to come up with a coherent thought that you can communicate with.

So what is the sense of cutting spending, and simultaneously increasing taxes to put back into spending that you just cut???

Sounds like going in a big circle to me. This is the Democratic agenda?? Shuffle the dollars around so that they look concerned, but never cut the spending at all??

All adult Americans who are even basically educated can see the B.S. here. We are paying attention as never before, and we all vote.

Wouldn't it be great to have a REAL President with REAL Business experience who clearly defines our nations problems, explains in great detail how he intends to fix the nation's problems, and then goes about actually doing what he promises. THAT would be a President that the Real Americans could rally behind and support. One nation, one great leader.

Classic Demo diversion. Smoke and mirrors with the tax dollar. Equal cuts across the board the go after the porkers, Defense, welfare, entitlements etc..

Truth in taxation is a must. Imagine actually knowing where the tax dollar actually goes. Straight tax rates with out loopholes Obama. Repeal the health care mess, the middle class simple can not afford it. Unicare with a one payer system. Merge medcare and medicaid in with it. Shift all the disables onto welfare and leave SS to those that contributed and they can use it for retirement. On welfare get ready to be drug tested, you fail off to rehab, you fail again off to live under the bridge you go. Living off the welfare dime you do not get to vote. You do not contribute your Vote should mean nothing.

Independents for the repeal of Obama and all his Capaign promises/lies.

Skip: The GOP has a plan, of course. They want to cut all entitlement programs, pensions, and low-end government jobs and use the budgetary savings to allow corporations to pay zero taxes and to allow the wealthiest 1% to have the lowest tax rate in American history. They'll re-criminalize homosexuality while they're at it and make Christianity the Federal Religion

Um, actually entitlements MUST be cut in order to balance the budget. We cannot balance the budget without touching entitlements.

My company froze my pension plan 2 years ago. Why is this heresy when the idea comes up for public employees?

Also, maybe you can explain why one of the corporate beneficiaries firmly planted in the Obama camp *cough* Immelt *cough* GE *cough* is paying 0 tax??

Also, I find a quote from this article interesting.

So a much greater share of income is now concentrated at the top of distribution, while each dollar there is taxed less than it once was. It's true that raising taxes on the rich alone can't come close to solving the long-term budget problem. The deficit is simply too big

By the way..I agree with you about the Christianity part. That's my major sore spot with the GOP.

This has got to be the most convenient Obama fiction yet. It is more of the same; pandering to his base's belief that all our problems are the fault of evil big corporations. There are three reasons gas prices are so high, and 2 1/2 of them we can do something about:

1) Unrest in the Middle East and North Africa causing oil prices to rise close to $115/barrel worldwide (a coherent policy might solve 1/2 of that)

2) Our falling American dollar (the fed)

3) Lack of drilling for our own resources. (that one should have been remedied years ago)

Oil is a world commodity, thats World, as in not just the U.S. It is ridiculous that the U.S. department of justice would be summoned to investigate. Who are they going to investigate, the Saudi royal family? Posing, can't stand it!!

This is the first time in history that America has not raised the tax base to pay for it's wars. If you look back in history everytime we went to war we raised taxes to pay for it this time we borrowed to pay for it. We need to go back to previous tax rates until the wars are paid off and our debt is drastically reduced.

I love the cry of class warfare from the right whenever we talk about taxing the top 5% or ... investigating price gouging by oil companies... really? The GOP focuses peoples rage on middle class public workers under the anti-union rally cry. It's not class warfare when politicians focus on attacking the middle class. It's only class warfare when anybody so much as glances towards the upper class.

It's only class warfare when anybody so much as glances towards the upper class

Your way off base, John. I believe GE SHOULD have to pay taxes.

Mr. President,

I did not vote for you but you are my president too. Let me give you some advice. Your advisors/handlers/iealogues are making you look plain foolish. If you would like to lower the price of oil there are three things you can do:

1. Open ANWR for drilling immediately. Speculators will be forced to rethink their strategies.
2. Drill everywhere in the US that you can. Sends the message to OPEC and the oil markets even further.
3. Release some national strategic oil reserves.
4. Shut up about class warfare for 5 minutes, will ya?

I know that was four things, but the last one was just some bonus advice.

Notice I did not say anything about windturbines and solar fields. Not the answer on a wholesale basis Mr. Prez.

John 1802062,

I'm against any group getting special treatment. This includes publicly supported unions, corporations and individuals.

I agree with you that there have been direct actions against public sector unions and that can accurately be described as class warfare from the right.

I haven't seen anything I'd consider class warfare against the middle class from the right. I realize things like Ryan's plan talk about Medicare changes that openly negatively impact the middle class. But, if you approach it from the perspective that if nothing is done, things will be much worse and the middle class will lose more than the proposed cuts, it's actually an attempt to help the middle class. I'm not saying you have to agree with this view - but I do draw a distinction between class warfare and alternate views on how to fix a problem.

Chas #3. The US Postal Service does not receive any funds from the federal government period.

They are self funding... The only reason they go to Congress is when they want to raise the price of services or to cut services.

So whatever difficulty the Postal Service may have with their budget, they will not be getting any financial aid from Congress if I am not mistaken.

Rational#3.1, Opening up these areas to drilling is just plain stupid and dangerous.

There is no shortage of oil on the world market, rather a glut of oil and has been there since before 2008.

The oil companies have far more permits than they are drilling. They have already received 10 plus permits for the gulf since the year began, plus all the others they had before BP/Halliburton and that other company killed all those workers with their carelessness and greed.

The only message we have been sending to the other countries is that in the USA you can do what ever you want, because there are no stringent rules/regulations regarding drilling like in other first world countries to answer to.

Even if they opened up these other protected lands any oil found there would still be sold on the world market first to the highest bidder.

For all of you Obama bashing Republicans.

Obama pushed through banking reform legislation that contained regulations on oil speculation while Republicans were trying to obstruct or water down regulations. The regulations are there but the CFTC that is supposed to be regulating oil speculation is currently sitting on its dead butt. Why?

Lobbyist In Charge Of ‘Trying To Kill’ Financial Reform Hired By GOP Chair To Oversee Financial Regulations

The House came under the control of the Republican majority and Frank Lucas(R) became the chairman of the committee that would hire a new director of the CFTC. He chose Ryan McKee, an anti regulation lobbyist devoted to "killing all regulation." This needs to be investigated and if McKee isn't doing her job, she needs to get fired. Lucas needs to removed as chairman and be brought up on charges of ethics violation.

And here is an excellent article on oil speculation:

‘Perhaps 60% of today’s oil price is pure speculation’
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8878

But how today’s oil prices are really determined is done by a process so opaque only a handful of major oil trading banks such as Goldman Sachs or Morgan Stanley have any idea who is buying and who selling oil futures or derivative contracts that set physical oil prices in this strange new world of “paper oil.”

With the development of unregulated international derivatives trading in oil futures over the past decade or more, the way has opened for the present speculative bubble in oil prices.

Since the advent of oil futures trading and the two major London and New York oil futures contracts, control of oil prices has left OPEC and gone to Wall Street. It is a classic case of the “tail that wags the dog.”

A June 2006 US Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations report on “The Role of Market Speculation in rising oil and gas prices,” noted, “…there is substantial evidence supporting the conclusion that the large amount of speculation in the current market has significantly increased prices.”

What the Senate committee staff documented in the report was a gaping loophole in US Government regulation of oil derivatives trading so huge a herd of elephants could walk through it. That seems precisely what they have been doing in ramping oil prices through the roof in recent months.

The Senate report was ignored in the media and in the Congress.

The report pointed out that the Commodity Futures Trading Trading Commission, a financial futures regulator, had been mandated by Congress to ensure that prices on the futures market reflect the laws of supply and demand rather than manipulative practices or excessive speculation. The US Commodity Exchange Act (CEA) states, “Excessive speculation in any commodity under contracts of sale of such commodity for future delivery . . . causing sudden or unreasonable fluctuations or unwarranted changes in the price of such commodity, is an undue and unnecessary burden on interstate commerce in such commodity.”

Further, the CEA directs the CFTC to establish such trading limits “as the Commission finds are necessary to diminish, eliminate, or prevent such burden.” Where is the CFTC now that we need such limits?

They seem to have deliberately walked away from their mandated oversight responsibilities in the world’s most important traded commodity, oil.

It looks like the key to the speculation problem has been and is the CFTC, the Commoditees and Futures Trading Commission.

Wouldn't it be great to have a REAL President with REAL Business experience...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You had one of those, his name was George W. Bush. You see what REAL business experience got us don't you.

I don't think I'd call what Bush had "real business experience". He was privileged from birth and he started with a large number of politically powerful and wealthy contacts. That means he didn't have to produce...only find friends that could produce so he could lobby for whatever was needed.

It is some experience, but nothing compared to say, a first generation millionaire that started their own successful business.

@BZe1:

Your response is completely wrong on everything. Just a small example:

Postal Service does receive Federal Money......

".............unlike other private businesses, the Postal Service is exempt from paying federal taxes. USPS can borrow money at discounted rates, and can condemn and acquire private property under governmental rights of eminent domain.

The USPS does get some taxpayer support. Around $96 million is budgeted annually by Congress for the "Postal Service Fund."......................"

Read more at:

http : // usgovinfo .about .com /od/consumerawareness/a/uspsabout. htm

Exactly Ron,

Bush got tinto the National Guard as an officer through the manipulations of his dad. Never had to fight in Nam. That is not real world experience.

To all those whom President Obama cannot do anything right:

Please answer this question, why didn't you have the same specifications and requirements for the Republican presidents? You are being hypocritical.

The Healthcare Insurance Reform act is not perfect; however, it is a definite move in the right direction. I keep hearing about "tort reform", (which the CBO stated would only cover approximately 3 more million people), as the big fix. It does little to help lower the premiums. However, if insurance companies have an influx of new people, they will be able to spread the risk further and; therefore, lower premiums. Below is an excerpt from an article written in 1992, sounding the alarm about the health care issue.

If significant spending reforms are not implemented soon, health care spending could account for 40% of the nation's gross national product by the year 2030, according to a group of Health Care Financing Administration analysts writing in the latest issue of Health Affairs, the quarterly journal published by Project HOPE (Health Opportunities for People Everywhere), based in Chevy Chase, Md.

In their article, authors Daniel Waldo, Sally Sonnefeld, Jeffrey Lemieux, and David McKusick construct three visions of health care spending for the next 40 years. In the most plausible scenario, they predict that based on current laws and expenditure levels, spending for health will reach 26.1% of GNP by 2030 (it currently accounts for 13%).

Again this article was written in 1992; reforms were need at that time; however, because as a whole, the American people do not take time to research anything for themselves, but follow the loudest mouth, reforms were not passed until 2009. Therefore, the reason the President focused on reforming health care as one of his first priorities was because health care expenses consumes a large part of our gross national product. If we want to bring SPENDING in line as all of you suddenlywant to do, the health care issued had to be addressed. I only wish that the President was able to institute a Public Option. A Public Option would have lowered the price of premiums considerably.

Is it just me or is Obama getting whiter? No I am not a racist ans this is not a joke.

Actually, some people of African American descent do develop a harmless skin condition that makes people get lighter over time. sometimes it also causes white blotches.

His Mom in him is coming out

And his hair is getting more Grey by the day. And oh the skin thing - Please why does everyone want to forget that His Mother is White??????

Donna: Technically, Obama calls himself a "mutt" since he is mixed-race. Of course, just about everyone is mixed-race in America to some extent. I'm darker than most European whites and my coworker is lighter than African blacks.

Is it the Michael Jackson disease?

JH: Michael Jackson did indeed have a skin disease (albeit a harmless one) that afflicts some people of African American descent. IT can make people lighter, or it can cause big white blotches. One of my coworkers has the "blotchy" variety.

Ummmmm wrong! I also have this condition and Im Caucasian!

Vitiligo

Vitiligo is a skin condition in which there is a loss of brown color (pigment) from areas of skin, resulting in irregular white patches that feel like normal skin.

Causes, incidence, and risk factors

Vitiligo appears to occur when immune cells destroy the cells that produce brown pigment (melanocytes). This destruction is thought to be due to an autoimmune problem, but the cause is unknown.

Vitiligo may appear at any age. There is an increased rate of the condition in some families. The condition affects about 1 out of every 100 people in the United States.

Thanks for the research!

In response to #4 who says Obama has broken all his promises and done nothing useful - from politifact:

The Obameter Scorecard

No Combat Medic,

Obama isn't getting whiter. He may eventually see the light and declare himself a Republican. That may make him seem smarter.

The bottom line here is we should flat out BAN oil speculation. A barrel of oil will be bought and sold two dozen or more times on the stock market by speculators. They are the people driving up the price of oil and gas with this speculation. The only intent in buying oil is to turn around immediately and resell it for a profit. If a barrel of oil is bought and sold more than two dozen times before reaching the customer as gas, all of those speculators will draw a profit off of that barrel of oil while causing nation wide inflation.

Do you want a way to stimulate the economy with no taxpayer bail out money involved? This would boost the economy by cutting the cost of gasoline in half over night.

The outrageous part of this is Wall Street caused this recession with a white collar crime wave. Taxpayers bailed them out, they have fully bounced back and now they are compromising the recovery of Main Street with greedy slob speculation in oil.

Unfortunately, I don't think the country will ever fully recover from the recession or be safe from future recessions/white collar crime waves until Wall Street gets ripped a new orifice. By that I mean all of the Wall Street giants need to be divided up. The banking/savings components would be separate from the invesment components, as it was for decades by fact of the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933 and its regulations. Savings would get FDIC and other support. The investment people need a loud and clear message that they will never be bailed out again. If they speculate like compulsive gamblers over the limit of what they can cover in losses, they will simply be forced into bankruptcy like Lehman Brothers with the CEO and executives having their assets seized to pay off the companies debts.

PROUD TO BE FROM THE SOUTH: So am I. I got as far away as I could get without going to Alaska or Hawaii.

I did not read all of the posts but enough to get the gist that there is alot racism. For gods sake - really ! discussing the color of Obama's hair and skin pigment. That's racism in my book and should not be a topic of discussion.

I'm outta here.

WASP BTW - just so you know that I am not a disgusted person of color - but a disgusted American.

This story must have brought out every right wing hack on newsvine

Obama's hair seems to be getting more grey. That has happened to every president I can remember. Must be something to do with the stress.

As opposed to Bush who taxed the working class to give a trillion to the rich. Soon there's be no middle class -- only billionaires and serfs.

Nope. At least not MSNBC.

Butterfly Mage

? Still about Bush, huh? Sorry - your comment only proves Rob is right. Still no accountability for his own administration.

Taxed the middle class? That's our Pres Obama you are talking about. From the price of gas to food - it's all going up. That will be the end of the middle class - not tax breaks for the rich.

That's funny, Rob. With the current tax structure, the wealthy are getting wealthier, and the middle class is disappearing.

Matt, the top 10% of wage earners in this country already pay 97% of the taxes. The bottom 50% pay nothing. Ya don't see anything wrong with that! All you want to do is tax the rich some more, while saying nothing about the bottom 50% who pay nothing! Again with the spread the wealth around.

Dave: The bottom 50% income bracket has access to less than 1% of the nation's wealth. so OF COURSE they should not be paying very much of the tax burden.

That's fine Butterfly Mage but; likewise, they shouldn't be receiving a refund either! Especially if they are not paying into the system!

That's the problem butterfly.... if they are not contributing then they don't worry about the tax burden...... in fact they get free money from what they do put pay in income taxes because they usually get back more than they put in. The fair tax needs to be implemented and there should be no loopholes for anyone. If we are going to fix our political system then we need campaign finance reform. No more corporations or unions giving money to candidates. One set amount for everyone running. Then you won't have people buying elections. Of course along with campaign finance reform, you need to do away with the lobbying. Lobbyists are the 2nd big problem in washington right after campaign finance.

"As opposed to Bush who taxed the working class to give a trillion to the rich. Soon there's be no middle class -- only billionaires and serfs."

Democrats have owned congress for four years and the white house for two. How has prospered? Banks, wall street, government workers, and unions. Who has suffered? The lower and middle class.

Democrats inherited 4.6% unemployment, a record dow, and deficits averaging $230 billlion. Since then unemployment has averaged double that, the dow is only recovering since republicans took back the house, and deficits are averaging over $1.5 trillion.

It is Obama and his minions in congress that are systematically destroying the middle class. Luckily the voters figured it out before it was too late.

Funny... Bush's Iraq war cost a billion dollars a day and was never put into the budget.

A flat rate across the border with no deductions would take care of these problems. Every one would pay their fair share, no one would get money back that they didn't pay in because NO ONE would get money back. The rich would pay the most, since they make the most, but it would not be an unfair progressive system.

Taxing the church would help a lot too. Religion is a multi-trillion-dollar industry that serves no purpose and has gotten a free ride on the taxpayers' backs for too long.

"Funny... Bush's Iraq war cost a billion dollars a day and was never put into the budget."

It's been Obama's war for 2+ years now..., and he has joined yet another...

To which I have often criticized Obama as well.

The rich seem to be doing just fine. They keep getting wealthier while the middle class is disappearing-not because trickle down works, but because trickle down is a failure. Now, in order to keep from paying higher taxes, the rich are blaming it all on $50,000/year teachers, cops and fire fighters. I hope they get so greedy that we are forced to become Socialist and sieze the wealth from those greedy, immoral elitists.

Sick puppy...

Im not sure how you say that the middle class is disappearing. Im a very hard working middle class man with a grown family. Im about 5 years from retirement. I am making more now than just about anytime in my history. I have saved and purchased 2 homes with cash and have my retirement planned out for 30 years +. I was responsible and planned, then kept a close eye on everything. This is something everyone should have and should be doing!

The way the middle class is under attack is 1.) stagnation of wages, 2.) hyperinflation of energy, food, and medical costs. If everything get progressively more expensive while your pay remains the same, your effective income drops.

I hardly think you can say there were no rich people during times with higher taxes. Which was any time from 1950 until today. There simply wasn't as large of a gap between rich and poor- and a more expansive middle class.

The thing is that the millionaires became billionaires at the expense of American jobs being located in America.

Butterfly Mage

As opposed to Bush who taxed the working class to give a trillion to the rich. Soon there's be no middle class -- only billionaires and serfs.

The day that the top 2% destroys the 98% that purchase their goods and services will be the day that the top 2% find themselves that there is no one out there who will make them rich anymore.

What will they do next? move to the next country that they can bleed like parasites do.

Butterfly... careful what you wish for. You start taxing the church then they are going to want to (more than they already do) start teaching creationism in schools. Remember the whole seperation of church and state? Taxation is a part of that.

Sadly, the Red States are already teaching Creationism in school. Blech. I would like to see the "churches" that dabble in politics lose their 501c(3) status. You can put the Mormon and Catholic organizations to the top of that list.

Butterfly Mage

Funny... Bush's Iraq war cost a billion dollars a day and was never put into the budget.

The total cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan Wars in Sept 2010 was at $1.121 Trillion Dollars. Iraq was not costing $1 Billion/day. That would have been $365 billion/year for 8 years. That would mean the total cost of the Iraq war would be approx. $2.920 Trillion.

The total cost of both wars has average $111 Billion/year. While this was kept out of Bush's budget, the fact that Obama includes it in his should not be an excuse as to why his projected budget had a deficit of $1.6 Trillion.

Sorry... the illegal, unconstitutional Iraq war "only" cost $1.8 billion per week. Gee... what a bargain!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15377059/ns/business-answer_desk/

If it was illegal as you say, then please explain why John Kerry, Hillary Clinton and other Democrats in Congress VOTED FOR IT !!!

Who voted for the U.S. to attack in Libya ??

TO: Butterfly Mage who wrote:

“? Still about Bush, huh? … Still no accountability for his own administration…”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Excuse me? President Obama hasn’t had a proper opportunity to even h

TO: Butterfly Mage who wrote:

"? Still about Bush, huh? … Still no accountability for his own administration…"

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Excuse me? President Obama hasn't had a proper opportunity to even have his OWN Administration because ever since even BEFORE Obama took office he's had to deal with the millions of problems left behind by the Republicans and the Bush Administration.

Unless and until Bush and/or the Republican Party accepts responsibility for running this country into the ground, hell yes it IS still about all the wrongs BUSH did.

How DARE you ask for accountability when neither you nor the Republican Party have taken into account your own horrible misdeeds and the devastation America has suffered at the hands of the Republican Party.

Now that wouldn't be the one the most Democrates voted for would it?

STLMike,

The total cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan Wars in Sept 2010 was at $1.121 Trillion Dollars. The total cost of both wars has average $111 Billion/year. While this was kept out of Bush's budget, the fact that Obama includes it in his should not be an excuse as to why his projected budget had a deficit of $1.6 Trillion.

if total cost of the wars id $1.121 trillion (it's more like $1.3 trillion but who's counting pennies) and since Bush did not include his share of the cost of the wars in the budget where did it that money come from? Is it one of those things that if you don't see it, it does not exist?

End Two wars and save 205 Billion a Year.

So are the three Obama wars in Obama's budget???

If not, why not???

Considering how the rich have ripped off the American people, yes tax them out of existence and close down Wall Street, it no longer serves the purpose it was intended for. Now its just con game.

You rich people pay 33+% federal income tax just like us middle class. Only you write off ALL of it, leaving US to foot the bill. If you think anybody is taxing the rich, you are sorely misinformed. Why does NOBODY help the middle class?

Ya rob, I'm assuming you're either a Republican, or a Tea Party member. You do realise that you just quoted what Fox was saying word for word? You are a brainwashed wacko if you actually believe that the rich pay more than enough in taxes. You do realise that the 22 dollars I have in my wallet is more then the big banks such as Bank of America has paid? In fact, they actually got money BACK from the government in credit, and they didn't even pay so much as a penny. Your views are skewed, please get help, and stay in school so you can become smart.

taxing the rich and feeding the poor would be the best thing to ever happen to this freaking country. im sick of the rich sipping from their golden cups while 90% of the american people are scratching and clawing for a living..........

Congratulations go to josephi, You have won the Massengill Award of the Day for your inflammatory remarks ! Guess what......... it's still early in the day and you were the unanimous choice !!

You called Proud to be from the South a nazi, a racist.....made general references to all Southeners as idiots.......and babbled about stupidity and hatred........while showing us all that YOU are the source of hatred in your post #5.37. You then ranted some more about food stamps, rebel flags and subsidies in an all out general diarrhea-like attack.

Never have we seen such vile remarks, both quantitatively and qualitatively, in one post...................from someone who will call himself a "progressive" !!!!

The price of your "gas" is apparently quite cheap.....you have an abundance !!!!

Edward-1075991

So are the three Obama wars in Obama's budget???

If not, why not???

yes, the two wars (Iraq and Afghanistan) are on the books (unlike during the Bush Administration). The third war is not because it does not exist.

Edward-1075991

So are the three Obama wars in Obama's budget???

If not, why not???

yes, the two wars (Iraq and Afghanistan) are on the books (unlike during the Bush Administration). The third war is not because it does not exist.

So those 1000+ tomahawk missiles exploding in Libya at about $1mil a pop do not constitute either "war" as you conveniently define it or a cost either........is that what you are saying ????

Furthermore, the drones have no war capabilities or cost ???? How about the ships in the Meditteranean ????

Wow, must be some damn good Kool-Aid 'ya got there !

Jim- Why don't you go talk to your boy McCain, he wants more action. So, if he would have been president we'd be shooting off more of those expensive missiles and I guarentee you wouldn't have sh!t to say about it. The posters on this site must be some of the most uninformed people on the planet, aka republicans. Who's really drinking the kool aid, I bet you're not rich but you pimp yourself out on newsvine supporting a party that could care less about you if you got less than a million in the bank. What a hack!

josephi,

No, what these posts do is bring to light the unbelievable stupidity of that empty suit in our White House.

You know, that walking mistake that is the poster child for actually being careful who you vote for.

"absolutely no difference"

maybe but the press sure as hell railed against Bush for every misstep he made. Dan Rather actually posted fake documents -- oh yeah fake but accurate.

Barry, there's a huge difference between Obama's "nanny government" where government keeps their thumb on you, conrolling you, keeping the people down, by giving them just enough entitlements, welfare etc.

and conservatives principles of empowering the people and strengthening our freemarket system so that everyone has a future if they are willing to work for it., but also helping those who truly need help.

Paul: the conservative government wants to keep its dibs on bedroom activities and what a woman does with her own body. It also wants to make sure Christianity is taught in schools under the guise of "Intelligent Design". So The GOP is just as guilty of interfering with personal freedom as the Democrats.

Butterfly mage This country ws founded on judeo christian principles, why can't christianity be taught in schools? The schools allow everything from hispanic history to islamic clubs, gay/lesbian clubs but anything that deals with christianity no. Now in California the Dem legislature wants schools to teach gay history but do not want any negatives on gay history just the positive. Gays/lesbians also want religious colleges to accept them. would you call that intrusive?

No your religion cant be taught in the school that my secular child attends at my expense, stupid!

Richard: Our nation was founded on religious freedom, not Christian principles. The constitution doesn't mention God one single time. The Delcaration of Independence mentions "the Creator", but the Founding Fathers were primarily Deist, not Christian. You can't indoctrinate children in schools because we live in a country with religious plurality. It would be grotesquely unfair to children of Jews, Wiccans, Muslims, etc to have the school system try to screw up the families' belief systems.

"the conservative government wants to keep its dibs on bedroom activities and what a woman does with her own body. It also wants to make sure Christianity is taught in schools under the guise of "Intelligent Design".

That's a lie. Typical leftist propaganda. Did Bush challenge Roe v Wade? NO! Did Reagan? NO! There are radicals on both sides of the spectrum. Shall I consider all liberals members of the Weather Underground? Earth Liberation Front? Other violent murderous left wing fascist groups?

If you define conservatism only by the most radical opinion, then we get to do the same to you.

Get over yourself.

VP: You can disagree with me, but you can hardly call me a liar. How about all the GOP attacks on Roe vs Wade this year? We have Georgia, where a miscarriage can be prosecuted as a felony. We have South Dakota, where women have to visit Christian indoctrination centers prior to being able to get an abortion. Then there was a state (Wisconsin? Maybe Iowa?) that attempted to make legal the murder of abortion doctors. At the Federal level, the Tea Party tried to defund Planned Parenthood, citing abortion (despite the fact that only 3% of their resources are used for abortion).

J-Bird and Butterfly

Why is it ok to teach other theories (Big Bang, Evolution, etc) in Public schools, also it is ok to have Gay Lesbian Clubs (FROG), Islamic Clubs, ect. Should Christianity be the only Religion (Theory) left out? Why shouldchildren from Christian families (which like it or not are a majority) have all these other theories/religions/lifestyles/whatever you want to call it, but it is unconstitutional to do the opposite. If it is offered as an elective I don't see why so many people have an issue with offering classes regarding Christianity in public schools?

Uh... because the Big Bang and evolution are concepts in SCIENCE! The reason why the drug companies have to cook up new flu vaccines from scratch each year is because of evolution. Tthe reason why all the stars are getting farther apart each year is because of the Big Bang. You can measure these things. It's science.

I agree that NO religion should be taught in public school, ever.

Barry Merchant, You are wrong. They are light years different in terms of their knowledge, intellectual ability, caring for the poor and downtrodden, enacting a fair tax code, limiting our military adventures, respecting people's privacy, ideas for better future for our country, etc.

Then, there is difference between what Obama would like to do to make this country a real 21st century nation, where most if not all have equal access to education, healthcare, and employment opportunities and a fairer, but progressive tax codes that rewards hard work and success. Plus he wants our nation to cut the greenhouse gases and combat global climate change using a renewable energy means combined with nuclear power. However, he has been stymied in all these fronts (except the nuclear power) by the US Chamber of Commerce, API, wall street bankers, and the republicans.

Don't point blank compare a rotten apple with a good orange.

Clubs are clubs, not school functions, not classes being taught. There is no prohibition on Christian clubs being established in public school buildings. It might be that there are plenty of churches around that have facility to house the Christian clubs that there is no need to establish them in schools.

u are a very wise observer of the situation.

I can't tell is you're being sarcastic but I REALLY hope so. I am like 99% sure that you are, but if you aren't.......

What kind of drugs are You on???!

hmmm, we'll still be in Afghanistan & I bet we'll be in Libya. Obama cannot even get authorization from Congress before he goes off & commits US troops to military action. At least President Bush got Congress twice to authorize military action in Iraq & Afghanistan! Our economy rebounding: hmm, uneployment is still at 8.7%, gas prices could hiy $6 by this summer; housing market is still in the tank & banks won't lend. Yep real great market! Spending less than we bring in with taxes: hmm, a 1.6 trillion $$ defict this yr, a projected 1.3 trillion dollar deficit next yr, a CBO report that the obama budget will take the national debit to over 20 trillion by the end of the decade. Show me where we spend less than we take in in taxes. Show me that plan! YOU CANNOT! Foreign countries fear us. I doubt China does, Russia doesn't! Libya is doing a good job of thumbing their nose at us. Fear us, they laugh at us!

Let's get a true leader then little minded people like yourself can talk!

Do I think he can do it? No Do I want this for our country? Yes Drugs? No I need to work really hard to support my family and those who collect relief.

a true utopian society commrade. i wish!

You've got to be joking right? And I am a Democrat and I voted for Obama last time but not this time. He has not done one thing he said he would do and we are not in "good shape"'. I don't know what fantasy land you are living in but Obama has done literally nothing but go on lavish vacations and do "photo-ops". I think alot of Democrats like me wouldn't dare vote for Obama. Remember he still wants to pass the Dream Act-where he makes all illegal aliens citizens and then we will really go bankrupt. I know what I am talking about. The illegals are breaking our country!!!!!!

Common sense; There is more at play here than a schools willingness to foster these clubs. Operators of public buildings cannot discriminate when allowing use of space. These clubs are not part of curriculum they are extra caricular activities. The gay kids probably need that meeting space more than any other club you cited. The issue of curriculum that teaches evolution vs creationism is steeped in law and research. Now for you or the parents of Muslim children to insist on formal curiculum that would actually be course work is not appropriate as taxpayers, all taxpayers are not participants in any religion. Whether yours or the other guys, I dont want that taught in a public school, doesnt your child get sufficient bible training through your church or do I have to fund that as well?

I dont think he heard you...louder this time, Washington is far away

Vote Trump! He's not morally bankrupt. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA You people are sooooo gullible.

Sahwn......you are not alone!!!!!.....I did not vote for Obama.....however I can honestly say that I would give him a chance (2+ years worth) and support him.......I am soooooo.............. disappointed!

You should be ashamed you gave him a chance. All you had to do was review his record as a Senator. wtf? over

He had no record as a Senator. He abstained from voting a lot and even missed 24% of the roll calls when he was Senator. Just like now, he was too busy campaigning.

Obama campaigns..., while America goes down the tubes.

Deb, You stated my case

Texana Deb = Yep very true. I myself have said many times - President Obama has NO EXPERIENCE!!!!!!!!

Mr President, Shawn has issued an ultimatum and is supported by people who are using bold letters in their missives, Donna has determined that you are inexperienced, apparently yearning for presidents with experience like ronald reagan. Apparently Mr President southern constituents can not afford to drive to the Piggly Wiggly and are quite upset. No Mr President, no they dont understand that if they cant afford gas they certainly will need medicare and social security.

Whatever, J-Bird let them cut their own throats. I'm going to start thinking like the republicans on here. I got mine Jack screw the rest of ya. So let Ryan cut medicare. I bet most the people on here whining everyday are already 55 and don't have to worry about Ryan cutting THEIR medicare. They (baby boomers)just want to finish the job they started, destroying America. Knowing they are the burden that's bankrupting America and now they have the gall to support a plan that basically dismantles it after they have sucked it dry, just like the oil and everything else in this world. Now they have pushed it all off on younger generations, while they rot in the earth we have to pay for their stupidity.

Ouch Melo, dammnnn, you pissed at the Boomers? I am one and trust me the ratio of dip@!$%#s doesnt vary much from demographic to demographic. This issue affects my whole family from brothers and sisters to grandchildren. It is ridiculous for slummy little pricks like Ryan to not get pelted with eggs and tomatos every time he pokes his pencil necked head out to speak. These selfish bastards take the cake and clearly want us to resemble more a third world than a progressive society.

I missed your point? Did you have one?

Why yes I did.......sorry you missed it......everyone else seems to have gotten it quite well! Go figure.......here is another one.....get ready for "PHASE II" in the Senate in November 2012!

Thought for the day. "Complete sentences."

I believe I understood the idea!

You have to be a pathetic right wing hack to understand that gibberish.

AlwaysFaithful,

Correct, Phase two....dump the remaining Democratic trash from both houses of congress and the Oval office too.

There are 22 Democrat Senators up for re-election in 2012. The righteous Republican party only needs to win three of those seats to obtain their rightful control of the Senate. I expect they will win many more than just three.

The country is changing. It may become an insult to even refer to someone as a Democrat. Kind of like calling someone an idiot.

Or capitalism...

capitalism? giving our technology,and currency to. an oppressive,and brutal country. allowing them to do protectionist policies. like devaluing their currency. they then call us protectionists when we want to compete on terms that benefit all the workers of the world. it is called elitism. by the top 400. elite w.a.s.p.'s of the world. it is the right and the left that are guilty. bring on a revolution on both factions. then we will get bto capitalism. i fear a new generation of cheney's,rumsfeld's,and rove's. the uternative sucks.i agree.

Wouldn't the increase of gas prices fall under capitalism? If you can't afford the gas or the products that are influenced by it, you can't buy them. That is what capitalism is all about, survival of the fittest.

So all the poor will eventually die off, exactly what the rich would like see happen.

But I am wondering, how much is this taskforce going to cost us? Do we really need another "government money pit" with the economy on the verge of collapse?

fxe78 - You have to understand republicans. They want the government to help them with things THEY care about. Bottom line they are a bunch of self centered a$$ holes who don't care about anything else except their own posterior. You noticed the Ryan plan didn't cut very much from things most republican constituents care about. And they have the gall to call it a courageous plan to make the poor pay off the debt. Thing is many republicans are poor, I hope they realize the folly of their ways before they croak.

yep......that seems to sum it up in a nutshell!

paul-440967 - Well said! And so true. How many times do we have to listen to his speech and it is always " I " not " WE" - it always about HIM!!!!! The last time I checked - there was more than One person living in this Country. He DOES Not get it and WILL Not get it.

Well said. We can't afford another 4 years with this "Non-performer". Speeches do not equal accomplishments.

Bush engineered the 787 billion dollar boon-doggle. How stupid are you people. Look it up.

I disagree with you he is not just sitting back and hoping that things work out. He has switched from doing harm to being a full time campaigner on our dime. What a joke he is.

And what a joke America has become to the rest of the world under his watch...

Paul I have a News Flash for you.... Im a Senior and I pay taxes..what makes you think Seniors dont pay Taxes .....thats ignorance plain and simple .. we hold more wealth than any other segment in America and we pay property Taxes (we own our homes) we pay State and Local Taxes, we Pay Income Taxes, we pay investment taxes.. where do you get your information from my friend....because I have a paddle SS check every month you think I dont pay taxes .....we own properties, Annuities, 401 K's, Stocks and Bonds, Pensions from our businesses.. you are so far off base you need to school up as my grand kids say....

paragraph 1- meant to say he should have been focusing on *other* national issues

paragraph 3- meant to say *should* not shouldn't... early morning.

No I dont want it to change over night, I want him to listen to the people and stop spending my money I dont have.. thats all .. very simple .... he got it wrong ... we couldn't and didnt spend our selves out of this stagnant economy, all he did was pile on more debt than at another time in our History and guess what .... you have to pay for it sooner or later and LATER is here.....14.3 Trillion today, if he gets 4 more years and keeps up his pace it will be 24 Trillion according to the budget office...24 Trillion ..... 24 Trillion ......stick a fork in America were done....you talk about taxing the rich more, how about taxing the 50% who pay NOTHING in Fed Taxes .. how about them contrubiting something they sure use all the services and welfare dont they .....

50% means 150 million people, and using your numbers 33% of that is an unworkable workforce (I.E. seniors over 70, disabled, mentally challenged, etc.) so we should tax them right? That's a great way to get out of debt. I never talked about taxing the rich BTW, i don't think that is the solution, but we have to raise taxes... I personally think we should move away from income tax and move towards value added tax. Why not charge on all spending, that way those who are taxed are taxed based on consumption... motivates the workforce, allows for larger taxes. Germany does it well... they aren't in debt. and BTW just to throw it out there Obama didn't spend 14.3 trillion, your an idiot. When he got into office the debt was already over 10 Trillion (accumulated) and in 2000 it was???? oh thats right it was 5 trillion. GDP was rising in line based on false markets (speculated internet bubbles and housing bubbles) problems based BEFORE Obama. I'll give you this, he did spend about 4 trillion, but that spending won't continue, we as the people will stop it. We can't determine if the stimulus worked for about 10 years... if it didn't well then we can blame him. But what do you want the government to do? Oh im sorry Grandma you can't get your social security check anymore because JustCarl wants to stop spending money. Once again, we cannot change over night, your talking changes that take months/years to implement. Your affecting 300 million people, stop thinking illogically. You clearly have never ran a business.

And just to make it clear, I am indifferent about Obama, I don't want everyone to think reading this that I am a die-hard liberal. I am a fiscal conservative/social liberal. I think social entitlements as well as laws needs to change drastically to match our current interests. We are moving away from religion, and have taken a soft stance on Marijuana, TAX IT. Why do "religions" such as the Church of Scientology, or Mormon's get to be Tax exempt? Your 24 trillion dollar statement is absurd, we cannot and will not be able to raise the debt ceiling that high. Keep making uneducated comments, try and play devil's advocate, but why not offer a PLAN for change... you have just made up a bunch of media spun bullsh*t. And as for the religous comment, I don't care if you practice or not or what religion you are, but I could make up the idea that zion is coming to rapture 1% of the population, but in order to be saved I have to give all my money to the Church, or I can believe the tablets of John smith, that only he saw and found Utah to be the holy land... come on, I have nothing against beliefs, they are necessary, but keep complaining about debt and taxation, people will find loopholes (and that is what these are).

Yes, no one expects things to get better overnight. The problem is the direction he is going. Democrats have had four years in control of congress and two in control of the white house.

Look what they inherited and look what a mess they've made the last four years. Is taking 4.6% unemployment and doubling it for a recored 22 months the right direction? Is taking $230 billion average deficits and replacing them with $1.5 trillion average deficits the right direction?

I don't think even old line republicans realize how peed off the average voter is about all this spending, let alone democrats. If Nov 2 wasn't enough of a wake up call, 2012 surely will be.

Valhalla, you are partially right, but your numbers are wrong- we had an average of 750 billion from 2000-2008 for average... which is a big difference than 230 billion, these spending increases have been happening before democrats took office, but hey i am all for electing a new government. The last 10 years have sucked, what can i say I cannot agree with you more. And yes 2010 was a wake up call, the direction he is heading doesn't seem to be the right one, but once again, We as people are to blame, not Obama...

i want to point out one of the most important stats... debt held by the public. Rose from 3.4 trillion to 5.8 trillion in 2008. This was because of the banking sector and the housing bubble, too much borrowing by the PUBLIC, the president doesn't control that...

Let's take responsibility as business owners, students, and employees and start saving and stop consuming so much. 70% of GDP is based on consumption, this number should be at like 60%. We need to start investing, you want to borrow money, put it into education not a house (which is no longer a viable investment). Put it into scientific research or schooling so that we can solve our problems... infrastructure, rebuilding the energy grid... if we spent our money properly, then I wouldn't even care about the 1.4 trillion a year, because it would pay off and GDP would be rising with debt, which is okay. That is what I am advocating, stop blaming the president and start blaming ourselves. I take responsibility, so should everyone else (whether or not they are the exception to the rule)

One more point... Libya... Qaddafi is crazy, he was killing is own people... we had to do something. Once in awhile you need to step in and say no, the problem is that we are selective with who we should and shouldn't say no to. France made a big deal about this because Libya use to be a province of theirs, but that Qaddafi is killing reporters and civilians alike. That cannot be tolerated, we had good reason to step in and fully support it, BUT OBAMA NEEDS DIRECTION. We may not be leading this, but there needs to be a clearly defined end game to this story, we cannot allow it to end up like Iraq (this is like Iraq of the 90's not today, when Saddam was killing [i think it was the Kurds I could be wrong] and we didn't finish what we started.)

Yes Paul we need to raise taxes.....ON YOU.....what we need to do is get the small business (Im a former small business owner) owners some relief and stop throwing money at the greedy Labor Unions and Welfare crowd... we have always been the back bone of America.. this President Crapped on us and tell me something he did to help small businesses.. Tell me one thing he proposed that helped... you can't because he didn't.. UNIONS UNIONS UNIONS... every picture you see him in was taken in a UNION SHOP ......Put small business on the same lever with the Unions and well eat their Lunch every time and put America back on the Black......This President talkes out of both sides of his mouth and says nothing or does nothing to address our problems that makes since.....Shame on the Progressives for supporting him, but then again you love socialism don't you !!!!!!

lol you didn't read what I said at all... I proposed taxing consumption, not raising taxes on income... I am totally against unions BTW, and I also own a small business you clearly were and failed... Oh and he did do something for small businesses its called the small businesses jobs act, look it up, I was actually able to hire more people on my floor because of it. but its okay, you have no idea what your talking about, don't read what I say and just complain. Again, blame the people not the president. We need total reform and I am for it... but again carl, you didnt read what I said, you just got angry like everyone else instead of coming up with a viable plan and rallying for it. Unfortunately for this country, we have people that love to complain but not do anything about it... instead of going out and making a difference, they vent online about their frustration hoping things will change overnight... instant gratification, we live in a digital world where everything is at your finger tips and you want everything right away right? Please read my other comments before your ignorance comes out and tries to knock me. If you had supported your comments with viable and factual information, I would gladly say that I was wrong, and once again... I am indifferent about Obama, he has done some good and some bad... better than Nixon, or Bush (Gore would have done a worst job so that era was f***ed anyway).

Ummm Paul the Dems controlled both houses for quite some time!

i never said anything about Democratic control of the house or senate? and if your talking about the white house as both houses... then 2 years? okay ill give you that they had 2 years... but 2 years is nothing with the problems that our country faces... My point is simply that the American people need to stop complaining and start taking action, start by saving instead of spending, start being more efficient, and come up with solutions rather than complain. i dont want anyone to miss my point here, it is not to save face for Obama, but rather don't blame him for everything... its not all his fault or even close to it. There are 100 senators, 435 house reps, and 50 governors... They are all to blame too

Paul,

The American people took specific and clear action on Nov. 2, 2010 !

In November of 2012, we will take more action !! Got it ???

I still support the President and believe he is trying to do everything he can to get the country back on track. No President in history has ever been handed the monumental problems this man inherited when he entered the Oval Office. I think he has done pretty well considering he has only been in office for two years.

Besides, there is not one single worthy candidate from any other party to run against him at this point, even most Republicans acknowledge that.

Paul, I am a retiree after 42 years in the workforce. Actually more if you count paper routes, lawn mowing, and other things that I did as a teenager. During that time , I paid a lot of taxes, SS, Income,sdi, fica. I also put my after tax and some before tax revenue to work for me for about forty of those years. I STILL paid income on the money that I have earned and taken out of my retirement account this year, so DO NOT SAY that seniors have a free ride, we don't, only the freeloaders and parasites get that deal.

..."the buck stops here"........he better form a task force to figure out what that means.

Your right he didn't spend the 14.3 trillion HE spent 4.3 Trillion in 18 months.. name a president that ever approached such a figure in 18 mos... you cant .. thats almost more than Bush spent in 8 years... you keep making excuses as we go down the toilet.. your making my case every time you open your mouth..
Now if you really want me to ROFALMAO tell me again you are a physical conservative/social liberal.... is that like being a little pregnant
and Paul Im to old to get mad over anything after all I survived Jimmy "Peanut" Carter.. I can take any thing you Progressive throw my way.. but the young generation is toast... sad isnt it
One thing to remember Paul... you can't teach "Experience" ... it has to be learned by trial and error and right now all your doing is making Errors.. Big Errors supporting a song and dance neighborhood organizer....

Just Carl,

Hallelujah, Best post I've read all day. Thank you.

Like you, I have been around the block a few times. I remember Jimmie (Mr. Peanut) Carter and his 18% inflation rate. His amazement and surprise when the Russians invaded Afghanistan. Along came Reagan, and his fiscal policies changed the monetary mindset of America, and the inflation rate moved back down to 3.5% Then he out spent the Soviet Union on Defense, stood up to them in Berlin, and B.S.'d them about Star Wars so well that they finally gave up their cold war ambitions. The collapse of the Soviet Union, that "evil empire" was the direct result of Reagan's policies. Can you even imagine Obama telling anyone to "Tear down this wall"?? LOL

I would hate to be a young man with a wife and kids and trying to make it in this Obama economy of today. Don't see much hope of it changing either,untill we change the occupant of our White House.

Carter was a clueless idiot, but this time we have a clueless idiot that is also anti-American, and anti-business. How low can we go??

Clinton=Jerry Springer

OBIMBO= THE VIEW

Hate to be a young man with kids ?

At 50% of kids being single parent , a young man , apparently has no say in the kids one way or the other !

Hows 65 years of PROGRESSIVENESS , working out for you ?

How can anyone believe what he is saying. He is lying to everyone. It is time for America to wake up and take back America. Does not matter whose side you're on, this guy has go to go. What a damn waste, and a tragic one at that.

Lying about what specifically?

echo, really?...lol

LYING about what. Let's see: Stimulus money (787 billion) would keep unemployment at or below 8%. It climbed to almost 10%.

Health care bill would drive cost down: Done nothing but drive cost up!

He'd close GITMO: Still opn & going to hold trials there too. Somethin he said wouldn't happen!

Said we (the taxpayer) wouldn't loose any money on the GM bailout. In order for the taxpayer to make all their money back, shares of GM stock need to be around $55.00. Right now they are @$29 & the gov't wants to sell it's remaining stock. hmm, sound like alie & a big loss for tax payers!

Says his budget plan will say 4 trillion on the National Deficit. Forgets to mention that all his new spending will still add to the debit until it's over 20 trillion by end of the decade.

I can keep going, but you get my point I hope. If his lips are flapping, it's because he's lying, not that he's eating chicken!

yes, really AR. Specifics?

The sad thing is, he is really doing what he intended to do. He said, in 2008, that rising gas prices would not be bad for Americans. That as long as it happened gradually, it would be fine. If people had just listened to his words instead of listening to how the media interpreted what he said, they would have known just what he really thought. Instead, they got caught up in the Yes We Can rhetoric, and didn't really pay attention to what type of change was really in store for us.

I wont have lobbyists in my administration.

I won't sign any bills with earmarks.

I will make sure ALL health care negotiations are televised on CSPAN.

I will not sign a bill with other legislation attached to the specific bill. See health care and student loans.

I will shut down GITMO.

Shall i go on Echo?

Bush had his share of lies too. For instance, he said he would uphold the Constitution, but then wiretapped American citizens without cause or warrants. He said he would consider gay rights to be a "state" issue but then tried to get an anti-gay Constitutional amendment passed (twice!) He said he respected religious freedom but then refused to let dead Wiccan soldiers be buried in Arlington until the Supreme Court forced him to. Bush also lied about "weapons of mass destruction" and the war has thus far killed 600,000+ Iraqi civilians.

So Bush's 'lies' somehow justify Obama's lies? Simply brilliant..., with an emphasis on simply...

Of course not. I don't like it when anybody lies. I'm just pointing out that bush does not deserve the quasi-deific status conferred upon him by the far right.

Butterfly,

Not one person in thread 16 deified George Bush. As a matter of fact not one person even brought his name up until you did.

jri, since nearly everyone in this post has attempted to lay our woes at Obama's feet, I would say "it's about damn time!" someone did!
He may not be "Quasi-diefied", but nearly every debaucle he dumped on America has been revisited and credited to Obama.
I am not an Obama fan, but I am sick to death of this right-wing missinformation campaign! Credit needs to be credited to the responsible party, Bush.
It was his and the GOP's deregulation of Wallstreet and US Banking (2001-02) that led directly to the collapse of the Mortgage industry. This allowed out-of-control interest rates that put the monthly payment out of reach of all of the American's caught up in it. All because of the greed of the one percent of American's GW gave tax breaks to.
I personally know of a number of service members who lost their homes in '07 and '08 due to fraudulant banking practices that wouldn't have been possible in 1999. Many of them received restitution (in '09), but their credit was trashed and they never got their homes back.
Oil companies and speculators still continue to drive the price of fuel to unmanageable levels, due to deregulation. Prices overseas have always been higher, but we are catching up fast. And the GOP is continuing to block any attempt at reestablishing the regulatory policies>
These two factors led to the Depression we have been experiencing for the last four years. Until Diesel prices come down to where we can transport our goods at a realistic rate, we are going to continue to see higher and higher inflation.

Military Man,

i believe #16 was in regards to Obama's lies.

That being said, you can go on and blame one party for everything you mention in your rant but i prefer to lay the blame at the feet of the guilty... past and current lawmakers and the ALL the presidents current and past who didn't have the guts to stand up and be accountable to the citizens they represent. Instead they ALL took the self serving way out and lined their pockets by doing the bidding of special interests at our expense.

As far as Christians deifying George W. Bush, I suggest you go to You-Tube and do a search on "Jesus Camp". It's a real eye-opener.

Butterfly,

What part of this thread do you not understand. I don't care if some right wing lunatics deify George Bush on you-tube, he is not the president any longer. #16 was started about Obama's lying tendencies. What do you people go to the DNC school of deflection regarding not addressing the actual discussion directly?

I think butterfly needs a razor to take care of the bush problem.

...actually, if he lied about Gitmo, I would accept that. I think he really wanted to shut it down, but realized what an idiot he would be to do so. Then again, I dont think he knows what an idiot he is. thinking out loud, thats all.

Well... Bush didn't have a lot of leadership when he gave the banks carte blanche to do as they pleased. And how about that awesome Iraq War with no mission objectives and no real definition of what "winning" even means?

George Bush is no longer President ! Grow up Butterfly !!

....yeah, and LIBYA is????????????????????????

No, Bush may not be President anymore, but he was the WORST one! We are still trying to dig out of the mess HE made! No sane person thought that we could correct it in 2 years!! That is just a Republican talking point! And now the Republicans are acting like if we just trust them again and give them another chance, they will cure it all overnight! Sure, just like they ran on jobs...they made that the big campaign slogan and yet have done nothing about that!

Such Bull@!$%# from you Charctine ! Obama has run up the national debt more in 20 months than Bush did in 8 years.......and Bush's last two years were the worst because of a Democratic Congress. Obama got us into a war in Libya (yes, I know, you libs are still in denial) without any kind of approval from Congress.

Barack Obama has simply made things worse in two years ! His so-called "leadership" of this country reminds me of a person trying to fly an airplane backwards !!!

Butterfly, let's get your facts straight. This whole financial crisis started with Jimmy Carter in the community reinvestment act. Then is was furthered along with Bill Clinton when he told Fannie and Freddie to back the toxic mortgages. Bush sent his people to capital hill at least 17 times to warn them of this problem. He had barney frank and maxine waters just about 3 months before it all collapsed, saying that there was no problem. There is no way to pin this on Bush. Do any of you realize why gas prices are skyrocketing? It is not because of any shortages. obama wants the high prices. Then he can push for his green energy. Secondly, it is the value of the dollar and the Treasury printing money like no tomorrow. The democrats state time after time that they are looking out for the poor. What on God's earth are they doing now? Not a thing. Who is really paying for the high prices. We all are, but the poor and elderly are paying the worst. The same people you compassionate democrates say you are looking out for. Who has the largest reserves of natural gas and oil? IT IS THE UNITED STATES!!!! But, under obama, he has not given the ok to expand drilling. Some of you will say that the oil companies have a ton of leases. Leases to land that they know do not have any oil.

Thank you Mark for another great post.

It seems to me that Democrats are very good at making a financial mess and then trying to re-write history so they can blame the Republicans.

I think they are overdoing the mess-making this time. Also, the people are watching their every move, every day. C'mon 2012.

that's so funny Edward---you guys are good, I'll give you that. That's exactly what the Republicans have been successful at doing....destroy all they touch and then blame it on the Democrats. Talk about rewriting history! And the party faithful seem to fall for it over and over.... it's like the entire Bush administration was all prosperity, sunshine and happiness in their minds. I guess if you made enough money from the war machine, maybe it was......

Republicans are masters at projection. Deny and counteraccuse!

And Jim: I stand by my statement. Bush got us into this mess. The deficit is as high as it is because, unlike Bush, Obama added the cost of Bush's 2 wars and Medicare Part D, that Bush kept off the books. Also, Obama was spending money to help fix the economy, or at least help the 98% of the country that the Republicans couldn't give a rats ass about.

What does President Obama have to do with gas prices? Unless he nationalizes the oil companies it's still capitalism at it's finest.

Like it or not, those are privately held companies and can and will charge what they feel they can get away with.

Funny... Gas was $4.25/gallon in my neighborhood during the last few months of the Bush administration. I don't think the president sets gas prices. This is a phenomenon of the poorly regulated commodity trading industry with its greedy/reckless speculators (most of whom are Republican).

Gas prices rise with the shrinking value of the U.S. dollar. Better get another "task force" to figure that out.

vsterry, what does he have to do with it? obama and the dems have spent like drunken sailors. To pay for the greatest debt imposed on this nation in our history, not inluding WWII, we have to print more money. This devalues the dollar, which oils price is based on. Print more money, oil prices increase. Don't any of you think that this is actually what obama wants? High prices means he can push his green energy.

You MUST be joking.

As much as I want Obama to go, I don't think we need another Bush... espeically Jeb Bush who "may" have manipulated votes in Florida to ensure his brother was re-elected.

Five liberal newspapers sponsored a recount and they all had to admit Bush won under every recount scenario Gore proposed. Get over it already.

VP: Well... it was a difference of 305 votes amongst millions. If the vote had favored Gore, you'd better believe that the GOP would have had a dozen recounts too.

Phil,
I'd heard it entirely the opposite. Since they discounted all the "Dangling Chads", that was nearly a third of the ballots in one district.
Even if it were a draw, if there were a general vote, Gore would have won. This is an example of the Electoral College antiquity.
The US is perfectly capable of having "every" vote count.

But that's ancient history. We just have to clean up the mess Bush left for us.

Jeb rigged the election so his brother could beat Gore? Thank God for that!

The mess Bush left for us has tripled since this idiot in charge stepped in....quit blaming bush, start blaming the current problem.

Can you just imagine Al Gore as a President?? And they poke fun at Bachman??

Yes, congress writes the bills, the president can only sign or veto. That's why republicans have so much power now, they can control the purse strings.

they're trying but it would be easier if we had a cooperative senate.! If Nancy and Harry had a backbone back in 2007-2010 we'd never be in this mess!

Dave,
WHO rammed the Stimulous Bill through?
Bush initiated it, Obama just established controls on the second HALF of the money! That was the second part of the bill.

Stop with the missinformation already!

Thank you President Obama your energy plan is working.

Under Obama's energy policy, energy prices will need to sky rocket. This is the one promise you fullfilled. Yeah, youre so dreamy.

Food, Gas, Ekectricity, Water, Clothes, Vacations everything will sky rocket. Can you feel it, this is another crash. Not even the tax cuts you extended can stave off the coming of this crash. We have 20,000,000 Americans out of work and you spent us into oblivion with nothing to show accept a huge pile of debt (@!$%#). We are so screwed.

Good job Ghetto Boy. I have a prediction we will not elect another black or half black President for another 150 years.

Our black communiies, 4 times the unemploment rate, 4 times the foreclosure rate, 4 times the poverty rate, etc. etc. etc. if we looked at your record without knowing you, we could only come to one conclusion the President with this record... HATES BLACK PEOPLE!!!!

Barack Obaman the EXALTED GRAND CYCLOPS OF THE KKK..... hey give America a break and resign or kill yourself.

You're a walking Plague, instead of "Typhoid Mary" it will know forever be called

"TYPHOID BARRY", "THE GREAT ENSLAVER", "THE SCOURGE OF AMERICA"

GOD DAMN AMERICA.... GOD DAMN AMERICA

very well put indeed...."God Damn America", sums it up dont it?!!

Mark, there are a lot of bizarre rants online, but I think you won for the most bizarre. Wow.

Don't forget the original 787 billion is now at 821 billion.